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Alternative gouges to Pfeil

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Re: Alternative gouges to Pfeil

Postby RogerS » 25 Mar 2021, 16:54

MJ80 wrote:I can give them a call of you want. Shipping from here privately won't really work as you will end up paying german vat, shipping twice and whatever duties they decide to use when it hits the UK.
Have you looked at stubai? as an alternative


That would be great if you could, thanks. I'd not heard of Stubai but again my problem will be getting hold of accurate charts to measure the correct sweep that I need.
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Re: Alternative gouges to Pfeil

Postby Woodster » 25 Mar 2021, 17:45

RogerS wrote:
MJ80 wrote:I can give them a call of you want. Shipping from here privately won't really work as you will end up paying german vat, shipping twice and whatever duties they decide to use when it hits the UK.
Have you looked at stubai? as an alternative


That would be great if you could, thanks. I'd not heard of Stubai but again my problem will be getting hold of accurate charts to measure the correct sweep that I need.


The Stubai sweeps are here:

https://www.stubai.com/en/woodcarving-tools/

You can download each sweep image and then print it out 100% if you want.
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Re: Alternative gouges to Pfeil

Postby TomTrees » 25 Mar 2021, 19:43

I have "ye olde Axminster catalogue" at a glance at the Henry Taylor ones what appears to be an accurate(ish) looking rendition regarding scale (as said, haven't much of a clue but carving)
and I don't have any of those chisels.

The printed lines aren't very fine though, looks like they were drawn with a bog standard 0.5 mm retractable pencil.
I must take some snaps of the catalogue, since it doesn't appear to be available any more.

Not sure what the best thing to show scale is, if a few rulers won't work.
Edit, here you go
Can take some more snaps if needed as the photos probably aren't great.

Tom
1.JPG
(323.76 KiB)


2.JPG
(323.75 KiB)


3.JPG
(292.34 KiB)


4.JPG
(301.51 KiB)
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Re: Alternative gouges to Pfeil

Postby TomTrees » 26 Mar 2021, 01:03

I forgot to mention, what else was featured in the magazine,
Victor makes a set of 3 in-cannel's, and also a set of 3 out-cannel's, but seem not to be in stock on the Axi website, some of the RIder ones are being sold now.
Not half as nice looking...
I hope their still being made.
There's no picture of the sweep, just a mention of the sizes, 1/4",1/2" and 3/4".

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Re: Alternative gouges to Pfeil

Postby Woodbloke » 26 Mar 2021, 07:29

TomTrees wrote: Victor makes a set of 3 in-cannel's, and also a set of 3 out-cannel's, but seem not to be in stock on the Axi website, some of the RIder ones are being sold now.

Tom


Victor and Rider are both Ax 'own brands'. I have a set of in-cannel Victors and out-cannel Rider; both are pretty good but the Rider's need some serious re-grinding before they work well. The steel however, is excellent as you'd expect when they're made by Narex - Rob
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Re: Alternative gouges to Pfeil

Postby Mike G » 29 Mar 2021, 10:57

RogerS wrote:.....Does this help?

handrail cutters (two off) redacted.jpg


Sorry, Roger, but somehow I missed this one.

I've just checked, and the closest I've got to the big radii is a 15mm radius. Also 14 and 12.5. Yours to borrow if you want.
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Re: Alternative gouges to Pfeil

Postby RogerS » 29 Mar 2021, 16:46

Many thanks to everyone. What I'm planning to do is spindle mould up some softwood and then cut some slices off, send them to all and sundry and ask them to see if they have gouges that fit the profile. I'll include you as well, Mike, if that's OK.
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Re: Alternative gouges to Pfeil

Postby Mike G » 29 Mar 2021, 19:38

Sure, no problem Roger. I reckon, though, you'll end up with a scratch stock or 3, and some shaped sanding blocks.
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Re: Alternative gouges to Pfeil

Postby Woodbloke » 29 Mar 2021, 22:37

I had an email from Joy at CHT today to say that they've received another small batch of gouges from Pfeil (one or two 'fishtails, spoon' and 'long bent' sizes) but it would appear that the stocks are woefully inadequate generally - Rob
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Re: Alternative gouges to Pfeil

Postby timothyedoran » 29 Mar 2021, 23:31

Woodbloke wrote:
AndyT wrote:Here's a suggestion that you won't find online.
In Bristol, we have a rare survivor of a shop. It's called Bristol Design and sells all sorts of used woodworking tools. They used to issue mail order catalogues but apart from a minor presence on eBay have not really shifted into selling online.



I've heard of this place but never been so it might be worth throwing the velocipede on the train and having a run over. There used to be a similar, but much smaller enterprise in Salisbury called Pennyfarthing Tools but they shut up shop some years ago due to lack of 'footfall'. They did though, have some nice stuff in there from time to time, including a late Norris panel plane which is still under my bench - Rob


In the olden days before Covid it's about 15 minutes walk from my work. It is a beautiful shop. It was cash only though, but that might have changed. It's a bit of a rummage through what they have to sort cheap or worn old tools from good ones but all reasonably priced.

It you want a day out, then you can take a water taxi boat from the train station. Walk up the hill to the shop then back down via park Street for food or the best ice cream at Swoon.
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Re: Alternative gouges to Pfeil

Postby AndyT » 31 Mar 2021, 09:48

I may be a bit late saying this, but just in case it's useful... Roger, you're trying to find gouges which exactly match the curves on your cross section drawing. I think you might be applying experience of spindle moulder tooling where it doesn't work.

The sections only match if the gouge is moving parallel with the handrail. And if it's held at the same pitch. And only for the final cut.

In practice, carving the shapes you want will mean, especially on the curvy bits, taking off lots of little bites away from the final surfaces, sneaking up on the desired shape, hidden inside. Gouges which are a bit shallower than the shape you want can do this. Even flat chisels can do this, as I think someone already said.

You'll need a template, from stiff plastic or thin metal, to keep checking how close you are to the final shape, but the cuts can be from shallowish, narrowish tools.

Final shaping can be scraped, with a custom scraper which you can make, and some sanding, using shaped blocks.
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Re: Alternative gouges to Pfeil

Postby Woodbloke » 31 Mar 2021, 16:16

:text-+1: :text-goodpost: - Rob
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Re: Alternative gouges to Pfeil

Postby RogerS » 07 Apr 2021, 16:41

Sorry, Andy, for the late reply. I blame lack of notifications !

I am fast coming round to your way of thinking. As a backstop, however, I made up a sample of the handrail on the spindle moulder and sent 'slices' to three well-known tool suppliers asking them what gouges they'd recommend. We shall see.

Lons has kindly offered me use of his Foredom and I see that the WeCheer chiselling handset should fit same. So that's another weapon in the armoury.

One thing is clear in my mind and that is I'll be doing a lot of practice on off-cuts first.
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Re: Alternative gouges to Pfeil

Postby SamQ aka Ah! Q! » 07 Apr 2021, 17:56

In Bristol, we have a rare survivor of a shop. It's called Bristol Design and sells all sorts of used woodworking tools..... the proprietor...is Charles Stirling and there's some basic information here.
https://bristol-design.co.uk/... I suggest that you give him a ring and have a chat.


No3 child lives in Brizzle; I have spent some pleasant times in the shop. Not a lot of people realise the stock in the shop is a TINY percentage of what covers three floors - including deep-sea diving gear! I once asked if he had a 10½ plane, as I had a very specific use in mind. He took me aside, into the entryway adjacent to the shop proper and pulled three straight off the shelf!! Doctor Stirling (PhD) is a truly knowledgeable bloke and very personable.
Recommend staycationers (it's coming soon?) plug in a visit if passing through Bristol. Find the hospital behind the bus station, then go left up the hill, Bristol Design is on the first crest, uphill side of the road.

Make sure your dependents and Mission Control do NOT know where you have gone and turn off your 'phone. You will need the time to appreciate the place.

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Re: Alternative gouges to Pfeil

Postby AndyT » 07 Apr 2021, 18:22

Sam's right.

One extra bit of information for any intending shoppers - they only take cash. I don't think this is so that purchases aren't obvious on joint accounts, but it can be a happy side effect. ;)
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