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Elevating stand for my new thicknesser

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Re: Elevating stand for my new thicknesser

Postby Rod » 25 Feb 2016, 23:01

Video doesn't work on my phone using Tapatalk but still looks impressive.
That's a nice planer too.

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Re: Elevating stand for my new thicknesser

Postby 9fingers » 25 Feb 2016, 23:17

Rod wrote:Video doesn't work on my phone using Tapatalk but still looks impressive.
That's a nice planer too.

Rod


I could never understand the attraction of tapatalk. Videos work fine on my iphone 3 using the safari browser.

I've been wanting one of those planers for years. There is nothing in UK like them (fixed table, moving head and induction motor) This one was imported from USA by the previous owner who only sold it as he had TWO!!

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Email:motors@minchin.org.uk
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Re: Elevating stand for my new thicknesser

Postby Rod » 25 Feb 2016, 23:33

Well we've had this discussion before - it's so much easier navigating forums with Tapatalk and I can post photos etc direct.
I don't have trouble viewing other folks videos?
I looked at yours using safari where it directs you to Photobucket and there it works.

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Re: Elevating stand for my new thicknesser

Postby 9fingers » 25 Feb 2016, 23:50

Rod wrote:Well we've had this discussion before - it's so much easier navigating forums with Tapatalk and I can post photos etc direct.
I don't have trouble viewing other folks videos?
I looked at yours using safari where it directs you to Photobucket and there it works.

Rod


Hmm! I don't think there is anything strange about my videos - just mp4 files. Maybe Tapatalk and photobucket don't get on? or are the videos you have watched been from photobucket?

I did think about uploading to youtube but that seems slow and for these particular vids I don't think there would be a wide audience :lol:

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Email:motors@minchin.org.uk
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Re: Elevating stand for my new thicknesser

Postby Rod » 25 Feb 2016, 23:57

I don't really know?
The last one I watched on here was DaveL's - no idea where it was sourced but I just clicked the arrow and it played?
There's been lots on UKW and again it's just click and play.

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Re: Elevating stand for my new thicknesser

Postby the bear » 26 Feb 2016, 00:13

Bob
The stand looks great. Is the motor on the thicknesser still the US one? If so whats the finish like on the wood, I assume its running slower than intended?

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Re: Elevating stand for my new thicknesser

Postby DaveL » 26 Feb 2016, 00:16

All of my videos are on YouTube.
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Re: Elevating stand for my new thicknesser

Postby Commander » 26 Feb 2016, 06:29

That is brilliant Bob! Very impressive and thanks for the quick explanation on the H bridge. I had electronics in school so I understand a little, but out of all the practical sciences electronics is by far the closest to black magic! :lol:
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Re: Elevating stand for my new thicknesser

Postby Mike G » 26 Feb 2016, 08:40

Excellent Bob, well done. It's made me want to motorise the winding mechanism on my planer/ thicknesser.

As for all the electronics.............I'm sure we can find a village which still has a ducking stool. :lol:
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Re: Elevating stand for my new thicknesser

Postby Newbie_Neil » 26 Feb 2016, 11:11

Thank you for the video Bob.

Your "raiser" is excellent, perhaps you'll market a version for a router next? :lol:
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Re: Elevating stand for my new thicknesser

Postby 9fingers » 26 Feb 2016, 12:12

the bear wrote:Bob
The stand looks great. Is the motor on the thicknesser still the US one? If so whats the finish like on the wood, I assume its running slower than intended?

Mark


Hi Mark,

Yes it is the original motor and as you suggest is designed for 60Hz. It is single phase as well so no chance of changing the speed. I've not really used it much yet to assess the surface finish. I've still got my DW functional for current thicknessing jobs.
I will possibly change the motor for a 3 phase one, run it from an inverter (just because I can!) to get the shaft speed up to the design speed. There is no room for a larger motor pulley and I don't want to fit a smaller cutter pulley as the wrap angle on the belt drive would be less.

A further justification for the eventual motor change is that the voltage should be reduced in proportion to the frequency to stop it over heating. At the moment, it is rated for 230v 60 Hz so needs 192v at 50Hz. My mains is about 246v and I need to run it from a transformer to stop the overheating and of course that reduces the power output to 70% (varies with voltage squared) throwing away a horsepower nearly.

I can see from the state of the windings inside the motor, the previous owner has run it from normal mains and it has been cooking inside so I really need to do something.

Thanks for your interest

Bob
Information on induction motors here
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Email:motors@minchin.org.uk
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Re: Elevating stand for my new thicknesser

Postby TrimTheKing » 26 Feb 2016, 13:14

:text-bravo: :text-goodpost:

Love this thread, thanks Bob.

Cheers
Mark
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Re: Elevating stand for my new thicknesser

Postby 9fingers » 26 Feb 2016, 13:34

TrimTheKing wrote::text-bravo: :text-goodpost:

Love this thread, thanks Bob.

Cheers
Mark



Thanks Mark,

I sometime wonder if my mechanical stuff (and electrical/electronic) is a bit too far off beam for this forum but it certainly seems to interest a few members and hopefully gives an indication that stuff is possible with a bit of thought and a can do attitude.

Bob
Information on induction motors here
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1dBTVXx ... sp=sharing
Email:motors@minchin.org.uk
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Re: Elevating stand for my new thicknesser

Postby Andyp » 26 Feb 2016, 13:45

9fingers wrote:
TrimTheKing wrote::text-bravo: :text-goodpost:

Love this thread, thanks Bob.

Cheers
Mark



Thanks Mark,

I sometime wonder if my mechanical stuff (and electrical/electronic) is a bit too far off beam for this forum but it certainly seems to interest a few members and hopefully gives an indication that stuff is possible with a bit of thought and a can do attitude.

Bob


Not off beam at all Bob. Fascinating. You diagram of the H bridge makes everything crystal clear. Still not sure if I will ever have the skills to replicate but your patience in explaining things is commendable.

Interestingly I cannot view the vids in Firefox, only Safari. Not sure which plugin is affecting things but for others who are struggling it might be worth trying a different browser.
I do not think therefore I do not am.

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Re: Elevating stand for my new thicknesser

Postby 9fingers » 26 Feb 2016, 22:07

Todays progress was adding limit switches. These will tell the controller that the platform is either at the bottom, storage position or at the top, the working position.
Eventually this will allow me to wheel out the machine, press the UP button and know that it will stop exactly at the correct level with the planer table at the same level as my table saw which serves as the planer outfeed table.
Similarly, when I have finished planing, I can press the down button and know it will stop at the bottom. This storage position is not critical so a more basic switch can be used with no fine adjustment.

This photo is the lower limit switch. It has a lever with a little roller on the end. This bears on a block of metal bolted on to the platform.

Image

Note the bolt, head down, threaded into the block just beside the roller. This is used as the fine adjuster for the upper limit switch and has no relevance to the lower limit switch.

This photo is of the upper switch with a spring lever and should be more repeatable.

Image

Here the platform is at the upper operating position and the end of the adjustment bolt is pressing on the spring lever. The thread on the screw has a pitch of 0.8mm so by small rotation of the screw and locking it with the nut and lock washer, I expect to be able to get a precise stopping position.

Image

I mentioned earlier that I will reduce the speed of the motor when the platform nears the upper position.
This will be controlled by a magnetic window burglar alarm switch. I've ordered one from fleabay so there will be a short intermission whilst I wait for that to arrive.
Maybe tomorrow or Monday, the power mosfets will arrive and I can start playing with the H bridge.
I won't bore you with that detailed witchcraft other than declaring it working!

Bob
Information on induction motors here
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1dBTVXx ... sp=sharing
Email:motors@minchin.org.uk
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Re: Elevating stand for my new thicknesser

Postby chippy1970 » 27 Feb 2016, 13:11

Nice one !

But it sounds like a load of chicks being run over by a lawnmower in the video lol

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Re: Elevating stand for my new thicknesser

Postby 9fingers » 27 Feb 2016, 15:13

chippy1970 wrote:Nice one !

But it sounds like a load of chicks being run over by a lawnmower in the video lol

Sent from my ALE-L21 using Tapatalk



That was one of the things that needs titivating. The chain needed a bit more tension and the jack legs lubricating. The main noise now is just the motor working fairly hard - the thing does weigh about 250kg!

Bob.

PS Interesting that you presumably used Tapatalk and viewed the videos OK whereas Rod said he could not see them.
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Email:motors@minchin.org.uk
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Re: Elevating stand for my new thicknesser

Postby chippy1970 » 27 Feb 2016, 15:16

Yeah just checked again on tapatalk you have to click the video then click follow the link

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Re: Elevating stand for my new thicknesser

Postby RogerS » 27 Feb 2016, 16:07

9fingers wrote:
Rod wrote:Well we've had this discussion before - it's so much easier navigating forums with Tapatalk and I can post photos etc direct.
I don't have trouble viewing other folks videos?
I looked at yours using safari where it directs you to Photobucket and there it works.

Rod


Hmm! I don't think there is anything strange about my videos - just mp4 files. Maybe Tapatalk and photobucket don't get on? or are the videos you have watched been from photobucket?

I did think about uploading to youtube but that seems slow and for these particular vids I don't think there would be a wide audience :lol:

Bob


It's not just Tapatalk and Photobucket. All I get is a grey screen when I look at the link using Safari on the Mac. Tried switching off Extensions in case there was a conflict but it made no difference.
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Re: Elevating stand for my new thicknesser

Postby RogerS » 27 Feb 2016, 16:09

9fingers wrote:
TrimTheKing wrote::text-bravo: :text-goodpost:

Love this thread, thanks Bob.

Cheers
Mark



Thanks Mark,

I sometime wonder if my mechanical stuff (and electrical/electronic) is a bit too far off beam for this forum but it certainly seems to interest a few members and hopefully gives an indication that stuff is possible with a bit of thought and a can do attitude.

Bob


Definitely not, Bob. Always fascinating and inspirational.
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Re: Elevating stand for my new thicknesser

Postby RogerS » 27 Feb 2016, 16:10

9fingers wrote:.....
I won't bore you with that detailed witchcraft other than declaring it working!

Bob


What do you use to construct the circuit, Bob? Wire-wrap? Veroboard (is that still around?)
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Re: Elevating stand for my new thicknesser

Postby 9fingers » 27 Feb 2016, 19:30

RogerS wrote:
9fingers wrote:.....
I won't bore you with that detailed witchcraft other than declaring it working!

Bob


What do you use to construct the circuit, Bob? Wire-wrap? Veroboard (is that still around?)


Yes Veroboard still exists and I use it quite a lot for low frequency projects. It is hopeless for high speed or RF projects when I use copper clad board with components on their backs legs in the air - dead beetle style.

This project needs consideration of the high currents up to 10/15 amps and so a mix of veroboard and solid copper wire busbars for the high current bits.

Bob
Information on induction motors here
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1dBTVXx ... sp=sharing
Email:motors@minchin.org.uk
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Re: Elevating stand for my new thicknesser

Postby 9fingers » 28 Feb 2016, 17:55

The postman did not bring me any goodies yesterday to build the H bridge so I have continued the job with parts I already had.

I promised you no witchcraft - this simply switches and relays.

This circuit is designed to take signals from the up, down and stop press buttons in combination with the upper and lower limit switches and produce un ambiguous up and down signals and be as 100% fail safe as possible.

Image


Under no circumstances must the up and down signals be on at the same time . If you follow the red path below, this is what happens when the UP push button is pressed momentarily (provided the upper limit switch is still closed).

Image

The uprelay coil is energised, the UP output signal changes from 0v to 12v and vitally, the supply to the Down button is removed and so there is no way the once UP has been selected can a Down command be issued.
The up relay continues to be energised until either the up limit switch opens or the stop button is pressed**

From the symmetry of the circuit, you can see that if the Down button was pressed first, the Up button would be disabled too.

**The only reason that there is a stop relay used in the design is because I did not have any matching normally closed press buttons but I do have lots of relays so I used on the convert a NO switch into a NC one.

The circuit is also designed so that any failure of the switches, relays or damage to the limit switch wiring will result in no operation rather that engage an operating mode that could cause damage.

Just before you ask about the diodes across the Up and Down relay coils, when a coil is switched off, the collapsing magnetic field generates a negative voltage pulse that could damage the drive inputs to the H Bridge, these diode will safely conduct away the voltage spikes by shorting them out. This is known as back EMF.

So if you want to make sure that only one of two events can occur at one time but either can come first, this is sort of circuit to do the job. It also has uses for a panel game situation when you need to know who pressed first and to lockout out all subsequent presses.

Here endeth todays lesson :lol:

Bob
Information on induction motors here
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Email:motors@minchin.org.uk
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Re: Elevating stand for my new thicknesser

Postby Mike G » 28 Feb 2016, 17:59

9fingers wrote:..........I promised you no witchcraft - this simply switches and relays...........


Relays are witchcraft. Tie him to a stake, quick, and someone fetch the matches........

;) :lol:
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Re: Elevating stand for my new thicknesser

Postby RogerS » 28 Feb 2016, 18:05

What happens when you press both UP and DOWN at the same time? By my reckoning, you have volts on both up and down feeds to the motor. But I could be wrong.
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