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Aluminium dust stains

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Aluminium dust stains

Postby Andyp » 29 Oct 2017, 16:51

If I were to cut some 4mm aluminium bar and insert small pieces into a clock face would ordinary turning tools be damaged during turning? And would there be a bleed of aluminium dust into the surrounding wood during sanding?
Or is this a daft idea?
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Re: Aluminium dust stains

Postby 9fingers » 29 Oct 2017, 17:14

I think you might get a slight ghost circle but sanding off the lathe with a ROS or detail sander should remove them. Try and go for the medium to hard grades of aluminium such as HE30 designed for machining rather than soft and sticky stuff designed to be bent/formed to get a cleaner cut.
If you can put the metal all the way through the wood or at least had a goodly proportion remaining in the wood as you dont want them catching and coming out at you turn the faces.

Worth experimenting with some scrap first?

Good Luck
Bob

PS How about getting some domed head ali rivets and polishing them up first and set them into the clock face at the last stage after turning and finishing? Make a wooden snap to protect the polished faces when you tap them home.
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Re: Aluminium dust stains

Postby Doug » 29 Oct 2017, 18:46

From past experience of doing similar things the main problem I found was build up of heat causing the glue to fail, even with heat resistant epoxy I had mixed results.

If you are just marking the hours with the bar why not turn the face drill the holes & insert the bar last off, that way you could polish the bar before you glue it in place & after the wood finish is applied so no chance of discolouration
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Re: Aluminium dust stains

Postby Andyp » 30 Oct 2017, 15:25

9fingers wrote:I think you might get a slight ghost circle but sanding off the lathe with a ROS or detail sander should remove them. Try and go for the medium to hard grades of aluminium such as HE30 designed for machining rather than soft and sticky stuff designed to be bent/formed to get a cleaner cut.
If you can put the metal all the way through the wood or at least had a goodly proportion remaining in the wood as you dont want them catching and coming out at you turn the faces.

Worth experimenting with some scrap first?

Good Luck
Bob

PS How about getting some domed head ali rivets and polishing them up first and set them into the clock face at the last stage after turning and finishing? Make a wooden snap to protect the polished faces when you tap them home.


Thanks Bob,
I like the idea of those doomed head rivets as the head would cover an slight tearout from drilling the holes. And brass would look good too.
I am stuck in the UK granny sitting at the moment so I am just dreaming up ideas. The twins want me to make them a clock each (a grown up clock without numbers) so I stopped at Stiles and Bates on the way here for some movements and hands and a few pretty blanks. Polished metal "spots" seemed like a good idea but I could turn some walnut or lignum vitae.
I am also trying to work out if and how I could cut some straight slots to take a piece of veneer on edge. This might be possible with the Dremel and a cutting disc :eusa-think:
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Re: Aluminium dust stains

Postby Andyp » 30 Oct 2017, 15:29

Doug wrote:From past experience of doing similar things the main problem I found was build up of heat causing the glue to fail, even with heat resistant epoxy I had mixed results.

If you are just marking the hours with the bar why not turn the face drill the holes & insert the bar last off, that way you could polish the bar before you glue it in place & after the wood finish is applied so no chance of discolouration


Thanks Doug, I initially thought I would want the hour spots flush with the clock face, difficult to achieve by just cutting to length and gluing in place. Bob's round head rivet idea is appealing at the moment. I think I will have to get some to see what they look like.
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Re: Aluminium dust stains

Postby Malc2098 » 30 Oct 2017, 16:22

Andy,

Just an idea, how about mother of pearl or abalone like luthiers use for guitar neck dots?
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Re: Aluminium dust stains

Postby 9fingers » 30 Oct 2017, 17:03

Andyp wrote:I am also trying to work out if and how I could cut some straight slots to take a piece of veneer on edge. This might be possible with the Dremel and a cutting disc :eusa-think:



I think you would have better control with a router and guide bush running in a template. Once clamped down there would be little or no scope for error. One of those cutters designed for fitting a dutchman 2mm-1/8" should do nicely.

Commiserations at being stuck in UK - but it is a lovely day.......

Bob
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Email:motors@minchin.org.uk
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Re: Aluminium dust stains

Postby Andyp » 30 Oct 2017, 19:16

Malc2098 wrote:Andy,

Just an idea, how about mother of pearl or abalone like luthiers use for guitar neck dots?



Oh yes. I like that idea. Not cheap but would look fab.
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Re: Aluminium dust stains

Postby Andyp » 30 Oct 2017, 19:18

9fingers wrote:
Andyp wrote:I am also trying to work out if and how I could cut some straight slots to take a piece of veneer on edge. This might be possible with the Dremel and a cutting disc :eusa-think:



I think you would have better control with a router and guide bush running in a template. Once clamped down there would be little or no scope for error. One of those cutters designed for fitting a dutchman 2mm-1/8" should do nicely.

Commiserations at being stuck in UK - but it is a lovely day.......

Bob


I would have to make a jig to hold the template at the right angle on a round clock face, but something to think about.
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Re: Aluminium dust stains

Postby Malc2098 » 30 Oct 2017, 19:43

Andyp wrote:
Malc2098 wrote:Andy,

Just an idea, how about mother of pearl or abalone like luthiers use for guitar neck dots?



Oh yes. I like that idea. Not cheap but would look fab.



Not as expensive as you might think.

https://www.ebay.co.uk/i/252477766439?chn=ps&dispItem=1&adgroupid=46395905027&rlsatarget=pla-327107325014&abcId=1129006&adtype=pla&merchantid=113574354&poi=&googleloc=9045467&device=c&campaignid=862328541&crdt=0
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Re: Aluminium dust stains

Postby Dalboy » 31 Oct 2017, 00:14

I would go for drill and insert afterwards.

Most ali's can be turned using hss tools but better with carbide tipped.

Still Here Andy did you enjoy your trip to Stile and Bates
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Re: Aluminium dust stains

Postby Andyp » 31 Oct 2017, 17:03

Thank Derek. The more I think about this the more I like the idea of mother of pearl. I think I will have to get some of those fret dots just to see how they look.

S & B is quite some emporium. Just standing in the door of the cutting shed was enough for me. Some gorgeous timbers being prepped and the smell was intoxicating. The kids enjoyed choosing the blanks and I was very good not to be tempted by all the other goodies on offer.
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Re: Aluminium dust stains

Postby Malc2098 » 01 Nov 2017, 10:39

Andy,

If you go down the MoP/abalone route, a lip and spur drill bit the diameter of the dot in a pillar drill is all I used for the dots on my guitar necks.
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Re: Aluminium dust stains

Postby Dalboy » 01 Nov 2017, 12:00

Andyp wrote:S & B is quite some emporium. Just standing in the door of the cutting shed was enough for me. Some gorgeous timbers being prepped and the smell was intoxicating. The kids enjoyed choosing the blanks and I was very good not to be tempted by all the other goodies on offer.


Luckily it is only 20 minute drive for me but was not able to get there at the time to say Hi which was a shame
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Re: Aluminium dust stains

Postby Andyp » 01 Nov 2017, 13:04

Malc2098 wrote:Andy,

If you go down the MoP/abalone route, a lip and spur drill bit the diameter of the dot in a pillar drill is all I used for the dots on my guitar necks.


Thanks Malc. I've just done an an I order for some new sharp drills and two packs of MOP dots which conveniently come in packs of 12 :D . Hopefully will arrive here before I go back to France at the weekend.
My lathe has a 12 stop indexing facility so marking out will no problem.
What glue would you recommend for MOP?
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Re: Aluminium dust stains

Postby Andyp » 01 Nov 2017, 13:07

Dalboy wrote:
Andyp wrote:S & B is quite some emporium. Just standing in the door of the cutting shed was enough for me. Some gorgeous timbers being prepped and the smell was intoxicating. The kids enjoyed choosing the blanks and I was very good not to be tempted by all the other goodies on offer.


Luckily it is only 20 minute drive for me but was not able to get there at the time to say Hi which was a shame


No worries Derek. The way things are here we might be back around Xmas.
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Re: Aluminium dust stains

Postby Malc2098 » 01 Nov 2017, 13:46

Andyp wrote:
Malc2098 wrote:Andy,

If you go down the MoP/abalone route, a lip and spur drill bit the diameter of the dot in a pillar drill is all I used for the dots on my guitar necks.


Thanks Malc. I've just done an an I order for some new sharp drills and two packs of MOP dots which conveniently come in packs of 12 :D . Hopefully will arrive here before I go back to France at the weekend.
My lathe has a 12 stop indexing facility so marking out will no problem.
What glue would you recommend for MOP?


I can't remember, but I wouldn't have used the yellow wood glue that's I'd been using for the build, I doubt if I would have used a two pack, because I'm a bit clumsy, but if you are good at detailed work, then a two pack would be OK. I think I must have used a jelly superglue, to cater for the absorption of the wood.

You can either fit them proud and sand down, but that can be a bitt tricky getting them flat, or you can fit them just under the surface and sand the wood down them.
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Re: Aluminium dust stains

Postby Andyp » 01 Nov 2017, 15:13

Thanks Malc, I was wondering about recessed or proud and with the dots only 1mm thick I can't afford to get it wrong especially as I will have no spare dots to play with.
It will be interesting to see how accurately I can drill the hole depth.
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Re: Aluminium dust stains

Postby Malc2098 » 01 Nov 2017, 17:00

Use the indexing to mark out and point a tiny hole, then take off the lathe and use a pillar drill with a depth stop.
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Re: Aluminium dust stains

Postby Andyp » 01 Nov 2017, 17:58

Malc2098 wrote:Use the indexing to mark out and point a tiny hole, then take off the lathe and use a pillar drill with a depth stop.


Yes Malc that bit is easy. Although I did not explain too well my concern is the accuracy of the depth stop on the pillar drill. I am sure that there is probably at least 1mm of play. Not good when I only need a 1mm deep hole. I will experiment of course.
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