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Breakfast Table (European Oak)

This is where we don't want anything but evidence of your finest wood butchering in all its glorious, and photograph laden glory. Bring your finished products or WIP's, we love them all, so long as there's pictures, and plenty of 'em!

Re: Breakfast Table (European Oak)

Postby MJ80 » 13 Jul 2017, 07:34

Where is the twist, in the table top or the apron?
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Re: Breakfast Table (European Oak)

Postby Jimmy Mack » 13 Jul 2017, 07:47

MJ80 wrote:Where is the twist, in the table top or the apron?


In the top... when I saw twist it's more a flex, spring, boing... if you turn the top like a wheel :)
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Re: Breakfast Table (European Oak)

Postby Jimmy Mack » 13 Jul 2017, 07:48

I'm thinking of adding some fillets (illustrated in purple) at the top so I can double tenon (here)...as the bottom is double tenoned (and thicker)
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Re: Breakfast Table (European Oak)

Postby RogerS » 13 Jul 2017, 08:04

I don't see how that will help you. It's the legs rotating/twisting. Those fillets will only act in a vertical direction, surely. I'm afraid that I can't think of a solution.

Very nice table BTW.
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Re: Breakfast Table (European Oak)

Postby Tusses » 13 Jul 2017, 08:26

Jimmy Mack wrote:I'm thinking of adding some fillets (illustrated in purple) at the top so I can double tenon (here)...as the bottom is double tenoned (and thicker)
Image


I don't think that will help much.

I'd suggest another ring, idealy half way up, inside the legs to tie/brace them together. or at the top a bit wider outside the legs and bracing the legs to the top
if that makes sense ?
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Re: Breakfast Table (European Oak)

Postby Mike G » 13 Jul 2017, 08:28

A cruciform link between the legs at mid-point will remove most of the flex, I reckon. But you'd need to make it quite subtle.
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Re: Breakfast Table (European Oak)

Postby Jimmy Mack » 14 Jul 2017, 21:09

Thanks Tusses and Mike, I'm going to have a play with a cruciform mid way up on Monday.

Thanks again, Jim
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Re: Breakfast Table (European Oak)

Postby Jimmy Mack » 17 Jul 2017, 17:31

Made my little cruciform today, glued up the top frame, preparing for finishing then...



Image

Poodles.... There's a dry split in my top... that spoiled the end of the day!



I'll cut it out and rejoint a full piece in tomorrow, glue up will be a bit of a PITA...probably blocks and wedges

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Re: Breakfast Table (European Oak)

Postby 9fingers » 17 Jul 2017, 17:46

What a PITA!

I feel your pain.

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Re: Breakfast Table (European Oak)

Postby Tusses » 17 Jul 2017, 18:37

:cry:
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Re: Breakfast Table (European Oak)

Postby Rod » 17 Jul 2017, 21:26

Bad luck very frustrating!

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Re: Breakfast Table (European Oak)

Postby Mike G » 17 Jul 2017, 21:45

I would certainly be trying that with filler before I cut it out. Mind you, I'd end up cutting it out anyway.......
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Re: Breakfast Table (European Oak)

Postby Jimmy Mack » 18 Jul 2017, 08:27

Mike G wrote:I would certainly be trying that with filler before I cut it out. Mind you, I'd end up cutting it out anyway.......


I did consider (last night), some West System epoxy could do it, low viscosity and will stick your granny! I did wonder about inserting a Butterfly Key; the customer in question might actually like it. But as you say probably end up cutting it out anyway.


There's a bit of flex so I feel the crack could run further than the eye. Case hardened, no doubt.



I've a strong coffee charging me up this morn...before I hit it with the rail saw...

Watch this space... hopefully no tears :lol:

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Re: Breakfast Table (European Oak)

Postby Jimmy Mack » 18 Jul 2017, 10:03

So far so good...ImageImageImageImageImage


Trimming the ends off this time... In case we have another naughty...

Image

Planned a whisker out of the middle so the edges pull in.

Image

Glue and tea time

Every cloud has a silver lining...

The mother in law will be getting a trendy Jammie Olive style serving platter for crimbo... That's saved me 40 quid Image

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Re: Breakfast Table (European Oak)

Postby Malc2098 » 18 Jul 2017, 10:57

:lol:
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Re: Breakfast Table (European Oak)

Postby Jimmy Mack » 18 Jul 2017, 11:10

Got away with that... Well at the cost a morning !Image

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Re: Breakfast Table (European Oak)

Postby Tusses » 18 Jul 2017, 12:39

I've never had one split like that .. and you know .. sort of stating the obvious .. I don't know how long it would have took me to realize I could just cut the split out and put another board in ! :lol:

I'd have been thinking, start again ! :shock:
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Re: Breakfast Table (European Oak)

Postby 9fingers » 18 Jul 2017, 12:57

Cutting, edge prep and re-gluing can be very useful if a table top cups as well. Almost invisible too unless there is a severe twist to contend with as well.

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Re: Breakfast Table (European Oak)

Postby TrimTheKing » 18 Jul 2017, 15:07

Haha, top fix.

Cheers
Mark


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Re: Breakfast Table (European Oak)

Postby 9fingers » 18 Jul 2017, 15:11

TrimTheKing wrote:Haha, top fix.

Cheers
Mark


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GROAN!! :lol:
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Re: Breakfast Table (European Oak)

Postby TrimTheKing » 18 Jul 2017, 15:12

9fingers wrote:
TrimTheKing wrote:Haha, top fix.

Cheers
Mark


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GROAN!! :lol:




Would you believe me if I said that was genuinely unintentional???!!!

Cheers
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Re: Breakfast Table (European Oak)

Postby Jimmy Mack » 18 Jul 2017, 16:52

TrimTheKing wrote:
9fingers wrote:
TrimTheKing wrote:Haha, top fix.

Cheers
Mark


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GROAN!! :lol:






Would you believe me if I said that was genuinely unintentional???!!!

Cheers
Mark



I believe you...as it passed me by, until I picked up Bob's 'Groan' :lol:


9fingers wrote:Cutting, edge prep and re-gluing can be very useful if a table top cups as well. Almost invisible too unless there is a severe twist to contend with as well.

Bob


Absolutely, a useful fix to know. I made the mistake of placing the MCM desk top on the table saw for a night and it cupped up a little.... possibly due to the temperature difference either side.

I was tempted to cut it out and rejoint. Though I gave the table base a shot at pulling it flat. On visiting last week it seems to have relaxed back down.

Tusses wrote:I've never had one split like that ...


I think I missed the split when I cut off my waste, I'm pretty sure it was always there.

SpOoK! :lol:






It's possible to re-join off a track saw cut too, without messing about on the planner ...if not too much tension is released. I think the hardest bit was the shape and clamping, though it worked out ok (for once!)


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Re: Breakfast Table (European Oak)

Postby RogerM » 22 Jul 2017, 10:41

Only just picked this one up. Cracking good thread Jim - best for ages! Nice job and lots of great ideas that you should consider pinched. I love the warts 'n all approach on these threads. We've all been there, and will be again!

Can't find an answer to the spring back question in the apron. Was there any? And if there was and it was anticipated, would you advocate making the radius of the jig just a smidgeon tighter than required for the final component?
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Re: Breakfast Table (European Oak)

Postby 9fingers » 22 Jul 2017, 10:47

Thanks for bumping the the spring-back question Roger.

Naturally I was mortally offended that Jim answered every other question apart from mine but I've sucked that up now! :lol: :lol:

I will be getting round to some lamination work now that I have my vacuum pump up and running. First job will be flat veneering but I do fancy a play with some shaped forms.

Bob
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Re: Breakfast Table (European Oak)

Postby Jimmy Mack » 22 Jul 2017, 13:33

RogerM wrote:Only just picked this one up. Cracking good thread Jim - best for ages! Nice job and lots of great ideas that you should consider pinched. I love the warts 'n all approach on these threads. We've all been there, and will be again!

Can't find an answer to the spring back question in the apron. Was there any? And if there was and it was anticipated, would you advocate making the radius of the jig just a smidgeon tighter than required for the final component?


9fingers wrote:Thanks for bumping the the spring-back question Roger.

Naturally I was mortally offended that Jim answered every other question apart from mine but I've sucked that up now!

I will be getting round to some lamination work now that I have my vacuum pump up and running. First job will be flat veneering but I do fancy a play with some shaped forms.

Bob



Thanks Roger very kind comments...I think it's only fair to fess up and share the goofs, 'warts n all' as you say and apologies Bob your question slipped right by, not sure what happened there :eusa-think: I hope you won't hold it against me when I come posting about electrickery in the future :D

Springing back to the question... boom tish! ;)

There was very little considering it was quite a tight radius at 750mm. I gave myself plenty of wastage, perhaps adding 100-125mm extra, as the ends are where the bag really struggles to pull in. Out of the press in 3 hours, the UF glue (Alansons- it's brilliant stuff) sets off super fast in the warmer weather, and spring back was pretty minimal, say 0.5 - 0.75mm at each end - especially helped by the UF glue which sets glass hard; I'd expect more spring with a PVA style glue.

Roger, if you wanted to be accurate, then yes I'd probably ease back on the radius just a smidgeon and be prepared for a bit of trialling to get it spot on. Fortunately this wasn't crucial here as I had plenty of play with the top overhang. Personally, I would probably always start with the curved lamination elements of the project and work backwards getting the rest of the piece to fit the curved component; if that makes sense.


After finishing with wax oil over the last few days, I glued up the table today with some Vanilla ice cream (PU), using a laser to site the top and bottom inline and correcting it slightly round with a clamp. If you look closely you can see the cruciform junction in the middle the little slots around the top are for hold down buttons.


ImageImage

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