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The Orangerie - duff glass-fibre-coating REPAIRED

This is where we don't want anything but evidence of your finest wood butchering in all its glorious, and photograph laden glory. Bring your finished products or WIP's, we love them all, so long as there's pictures, and plenty of 'em!

The Orangerie - duff glass-fibre-coating REPAIRED

Postby RogerS » 07 Jun 2018, 15:26

Well, we're off. This is the basic design ...well, up to the top of the walls as the lead was so damn expensive...see t'other thread.

orangerie%20draft%201.png
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And arrived today, 2 cu m of 9 x 2 unsorted redwood. Superb quality.

Image

Image

Some of the pieces are so damn long (4m +) that if I want to take advantage of them I'm going to have to shift the Hammer over. :(

The cills I settled on to outsource and made out of Sapele...Accoya was eye-wateringly expensive. Someone else can do the moulding of the slope on the cills and the drip groove !
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Re: The Orangerie

Postby Coley » 07 Jun 2018, 16:18

I think you made a good decision having sapele cills Nice pile of timber !

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Re: The Orangerie

Postby Phil » 07 Jun 2018, 17:03

Roger, nice load of timber.

This will be an interesting project.

Were you not going to move South again or are you getting used to the rain?
Please load some pics of feet and hands to show they are not webbed. :lol:
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Re: The Orangerie

Postby Mike G » 07 Jun 2018, 20:13

I hope you've got that covered up, or moved. The sun on that timber could wreck it. I left a beautiful straight piece of timber on my roofrack yesterday for 3 or 4 hours, and am now dealing with a propeller.
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Re: The Orangerie

Postby RogerS » 07 Jun 2018, 20:22

Mike G wrote:I hope you've got that covered up, or moved. The sun on that timber could wreck it. I left a beautiful straight piece of timber on my roofrack yesterday for 3 or 4 hours, and am now dealing with a propeller.


I covered it with old white sheets. Tomorrow it goes into the workshop. If I can lift some of those longer lengths, that is.
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Re: The Orangerie

Postby Rod » 07 Jun 2018, 20:59

Knock up a couple of boards with castors and wheel them in.

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Re: The Orangerie

Postby RogerS » 01 Jul 2018, 09:48

All the wood carried by hand into the workshop. The sapele cills have been moulded for me by a local joinery shop. TBH I'd rather pay them to handle those 4.5m long lengths...compared to buying in the wood myself or getting them to supply and mould...it worked out about a tenner a length for them to do the graft. Well worth it IMO.

And therein lies the rub. Here is the basic design - roof still TBD. Internal area just within the limits to avoid Building Control.

orangerie 1.png
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The design is "windows - doors - windows - doors - windows" down the long 8m front. All window and door elements are essentially identical to aid prefabrication by me - sort of batch production. The ovals and glazing bars will be plant-ons. The ends have had a slightly different smaller window panel added but otherwise same criteria.

The idea was then to make a frame

orangerie cill and frame 1.jpg
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into which the prefabricated window and door elements will slide in. The first design was to have the frame stiles this way round - (A) - stiles 100mm x 50mm.

orangerie cill and frame.jpg
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But then I realised that the timber I have is only 60mm or so sawn and so after planing etc chances are it might not make the 50mm. So I redesigned it - (B). 110mm x 40mm. And that also let me do away with the filler used in (A) to get the stiles to the correct width. I'd also do away with the need for sub-frames.

Then I realised that that gave me a problem trying to build the frame in-situ as I wanted to minimise the joins in the cills. I could have had a bash at making each side by lying it on its side as I made it up but then trying to manhandle a heavy 8m x 2.3m high frame to the vertical by myself and without twisting and breaking it would be nigh on impossible. Not a chance of making them in the workshop and carrying them out either.

Back to the drawing board. The other question also was how level was the plinth.

P1130236.JPG
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So I've decided to go full-circle and back to making sub-frames. The cills will be fixed and levelled and made as co-planar as possible to the plinth. (C)

Then I'll make sub-frames in the workshop, carry out and fix to each other using a filler piece to get the spacing between them right and provide for final tweaking to get it all to fit. (D)

orangerie cill and frame 2.jpg
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Potential problems are :

1) how do I keep that plinth from filling up with water and making a bath ? I think the best way is to leave the undersides of the cills clear so that there will be the inevitable gap between that and the DPM. That way surplus water can escape. Once the building has been made watertight then I can seal them. The cills will have been painted using linseed oil paint underneath.
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Re: The Orangerie

Postby Malc2098 » 01 Jul 2018, 10:11

To try and stop my plinth filling up, I made a sort of ridge tent arrangement with timber and tarps, but that worked only for the time I wasn't working on the site.
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Re: The Orangerie

Postby Rod » 01 Jul 2018, 11:55

Leave the mortar out of the brickwork sides in the low spots then point up afterwards. The water should drain through.

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Re: The Orangerie

Postby RogerS » 01 Jul 2018, 12:28

Rod wrote:Leave the mortar out of the brickwork sides in the low spots then point up afterwards. The water should drain through.

Rod


It's not the traditional plinth, Rod. Originally there were to be small dwarf walls and so my builder made a short retaining wall of double skin with pier supports on each side of where the doors would go.

The a DPM was put on the inside and it was then filled with concrete. So basically I have a concrete slab but with a DPM underneath and then up and over the sides.

P1130237.JPG
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P1130238.JPG
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Then LOML changed her mind :evil: No dwarf walls and so my cills go straight onto the DPM/slab.

Thinking it through, where the doors originally were planned to go, the cavity also goes so I could remove a brick from the outside skin and gently remove the edge off the internal concrete corner.

P1130239.JPG
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Then there might be a gentler bit of slope I can finesse in the DPM so that I have an exit channel underneath the cill to sweep the water away. Having said that a large tarpaulin and a siphon will do but a pain to keep emptying.
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Re: The Orangerie

Postby RogerS » 04 Jul 2018, 08:59

The underside of the cills had two coats of linseed oil paint applied and attracted a fair bit of insect and plant life while drying outside. So for the top surfaces I came indoors. Nothing like having a 5m square hall as a painting area :)

Image

Image

And it means that I can make sawdust in the workshop while this lot are drying.

Image

I'm really taken by this linseed oil paint. Brilliant stuff.

I've not yet told SWMBO that the hall is going to be my assembly and glue-up area ! :eusa-whistle:
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Re: The Orangerie

Postby Malc2098 » 04 Jul 2018, 09:23

I still really like your staircase!
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Re: The Orangerie

Postby Andyp » 04 Jul 2018, 10:10

It wont be long before she notices, Roger, or does she use a different entrance?
I do not think therefore I do not am.

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Re: The Orangerie

Postby Rod » 04 Jul 2018, 11:37

The servant’s or trade entrance

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Re: The Orangerie

Postby Coley » 04 Jul 2018, 14:40

Nice big work area ! how long has it been since you applied it ? Is it patchy like myself and a few others had on the ukw thread ?

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Re: The Orangerie

Postby RogerS » 04 Jul 2018, 15:18

Coley wrote:Nice big work area ! how long has it been since you applied it ? Is it patchy like myself and a few others had on the ukw thread ?

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No it isn't. You need three coats to do a proper job.

Coat 1 - seeps into the wood and seals it

Coat 2 - starts to cover with the colour

Coat 3 - really finishes it off

It also depends on the manufacturer, I think. I've been using Allback

Goes off pretty much in 24 hours.

I'm sold on it.
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Re: The Orangerie

Postby Coley » 04 Jul 2018, 15:28

That's the same stuff I used. It must have something to do with me wrongly degreasing the wood first with meths. Just a bit odd that the other guy had similar blotchyness.....Did you use the zinc additive for the first coat or perhaps follow Jacobs recommendation and prime first with linseed oil ?
A few close up pics would be good if you get chance, apologies for the slight hijack
I've still got a few different colours and another linseed brand to try sometime. It's finding the enthusiasm though....

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Re: The Orangerie

Postby RogerS » 04 Jul 2018, 16:36

I didn't degrease the wood nor did I apply linseed oil by itself.

Here are a few photos after two coats. My only criticism is that you can see brush marks but that might just be me.

P1130255.JPG
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P1130254.JPG
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Re: The Orangerie

Postby Coley » 04 Jul 2018, 17:08

That looks superb Roger ! No wonder you're pleased with it Thanks for the extra pictures Did you clean the brush out in between coats or let it soak in a pot of linseed oil ? That finish I'd be more than happy to put my name to, my slightly blotchy effort though didn't leave me 100% happy.

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Re: The Orangerie

Postby RogerS » 04 Jul 2018, 17:14

Thanks, Coley. I just hung the brush in raw linseed oil as recommended. Bought a special brush from Oricalcum..maybe the brush makes a difference ?

What wood did you use ? Mine is sapele.
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Re: The Orangerie

Postby Coley » 04 Jul 2018, 17:35

Mine was sapele as well Roger. I made many many errors by the sound of it. Degreasing the wood= bad, washing out the brush between coats with white spirit, also bad. I used a bog standard paint brush, but also used the zinc additive on the first coat- whether that makes a difference.
Sounds like I tried to hard and should just brush it on and keep the brush in linseed paint between coats
Full thread with pictures can be seen here https://www.ukworkshop.co.uk/forums/try ... 07300.html
I reckon a few people over there would be interested to see your finished paint !!


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Re: The Orangerie

Postby RogerS » 04 Jul 2018, 18:19

The Allback manual is very specific in not using any solvents.
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Re: The Orangerie

Postby DaveL » 04 Jul 2018, 21:18

Roger,

Would you mind telling me which supplier you bought the paint from? We have a wooden back door which faces almost due south that I need to refinish and I think I might be interested in using that paint.
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Re: The Orangerie

Postby RogerS » 05 Jul 2018, 04:32

Not at all.

swedishlinseedpaint.co.uk

Very useful set of videos hear and IIRC one of them covers your scenario.

https://www.linoljeprodukter.se/interna ... eo-archive
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Re: The Orangerie

Postby RogerS » 05 Jul 2018, 06:53

Coley wrote:Mine was sapele as well Roger. I made many many errors by the sound of it. Degreasing the wood= bad, washing out the brush between coats with white spirit, also bad. I used a bog standard paint brush, but also used the zinc additive on the first coat- whether that makes a difference.
Sounds like I tried to hard and should just brush it on and keep the brush in linseed paint between coats
Full thread with pictures can be seen here https://www.ukworkshop.co.uk/forums/try ... 07300.html
I reckon a few people over there would be interested to see your finished paint !!


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Had a quick look at that very long thread! Confirmed my views about taking everything that certain person says with a huge pinch of salt. Gareth Harvey seems to know what he istalking about, on the other hand.

My second coat is taking a bit longer to dry possibly due to too thick a coat. It is quite hard to get a thin coat on as the paint is so 'rich' as it were. Not like 'making love in a canoe' Farrow & Ball paint.
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