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The Orangerie - duff glass-fibre-coating REPAIRED

This is where we don't want anything but evidence of your finest wood butchering in all its glorious, and photograph laden glory. Bring your finished products or WIP's, we love them all, so long as there's pictures, and plenty of 'em!

Re: The Orangerie - time for the 'walls'

Postby MY63 » 01 May 2019, 19:51

Excellent work
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Re: The Orangerie - time for the 'walls'

Postby Coley » 02 May 2019, 04:27

There doesn't seem like alot of glue area for tenons/wedges between the rails and stiles. If some of the doors will be opening I'd definitely look at having the panels fixed or tight to help brace the door- that's assuming the doors are to be painted and the panels will be from ultra stable tricoya mdf.

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Re: The Orangerie - time for the 'walls'

Postby RogerS » 02 May 2019, 06:21

Coley wrote:There doesn't seem like alot of glue area for tenons/wedges between the rails and stiles. If some of the doors will be opening I'd definitely look at having the panels fixed or tight to help brace the door- that's assuming the doors are to be painted and the panels will be from ultra stable tricoya mdf.

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You're an early bird as well ! Yes some of the doors will open. Lots of external dominos. Am a tad concerned about the thickness of the stiles but we are where we are...size is determined by those window ovals now.

Actually there are rebates down the stiles for the glass and so a reasonable amount of glue area with the rails (rebated to match). The more I think about it the more I'm tempted to glue and screw the fixed panels in situ.

Doors and panel will be painted (linseed ...whey hey !). The bottom panel is Medite External. Tricoya :o Do you think I'm made of money ? Bad enough shelling out a couple of sheets at £70 a time :lol:
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Re: The Orangerie - time for the 'walls'

Postby Coley » 02 May 2019, 06:30

Gluing and screwing will definitely help prevent the door dropping. £70 a sheet is cheap so must be fairly thin? Last time I checked they were after £130 a sheet for 18mm- but it's still cheap compared to gluing up panels and having to make allowances for movement.
Issues with my niece are causing the sleepless nights

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Re: The Orangerie - time for the 'walls'

Postby Coley » 02 May 2019, 06:32

How high are your doors and how thick? A few extra hinges and multi point locks if you're really concerned should keep them under control.

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Re: The Orangerie - time for the 'walls'

Postby RogerS » 02 May 2019, 07:34

Coley wrote:Gluing and screwing will definitely help prevent the door dropping. £70 a sheet is cheap so must be fairly thin? Last time I checked they were after £130 a sheet for 18mm- but it's still cheap compared to gluing up panels and having to make allowances for movement.
Issues with my niece are causing the sleepless nights

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18mm sheets. Big price variation :eusa-think:
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Re: The Orangerie - time for the 'walls'

Postby RogerS » 02 May 2019, 07:35

Coley wrote:How high are your doors and how thick? A few extra hinges and multi point locks if you're really concerned should keep them under control.

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2m high. 45mm thick. I was going to put some extra hinges on. Not sure about the multipoint locks as I've never fitted them plus they sound pricey. But do they stabilise the opening stile the same way a bunch of hinges do at t'other end ?
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Re: The Orangerie - time for the 'walls'

Postby Coley » 02 May 2019, 08:04

This is a price list for tricoya from 2018
Image

Your £70 a sheet is a bargain !!! Are you sure you didn't have 18mm external mdf?

Multipoint locks would help prevent the closing side from twisting, though thinking about it your Stiles probably wouldnt be big enough to take them.

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Re: The Orangerie - time for the 'walls'

Postby RogerS » 02 May 2019, 09:18

Ah..I see the confusion. My bad. I thought that I'd mentioned I was using Medite External.

Appreciate the advice re the stiles/multipoint locks.
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Re: The Orangerie - time for the 'walls'

Postby RogerS » 02 May 2019, 18:01

I wonder if a window espagnolette will work for the doors ?
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Re: The Orangerie - time for the 'walls'

Postby Malc2098 » 02 May 2019, 18:08

Would surface espagnolette bolts, like the French have, work and look good?

https://www.sdslondon.co.uk/surface-espagnolette-bolts.html
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Re: The Orangerie - time for the 'walls'

Postby RogerS » 02 May 2019, 21:34

Malc2098 wrote:Would surface espagnolette bolts, like the French have, work and look good?

https://www.sdslondon.co.uk/surface-espagnolette-bolts.html



Wot ? At those prices :o I need six of them. Even one would be OTT :lol:
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Re: The Orangerie - time for the 'walls'

Postby 9fingers » 02 May 2019, 21:45

RogerS wrote:
Malc2098 wrote:Would surface espagnolette bolts, like the French have, work and look good?

https://www.sdslondon.co.uk/surface-espagnolette-bolts.html



Wot ? At those prices :o I need six of them. Even one would be OTT :lol:


Check out multipoint locks Roger.
Many are available with only 50mm lock depth and 35 mm backset so I'd have thought they would be bound to be accommodated in your stiles. Possibly looking at nearer 120 notes per lock.

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Re: The Orangerie - time for the 'walls'

Postby 9fingers » 02 May 2019, 21:58

Screwfix have a couple of yale ones at £70 and £86

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Re: The Orangerie - time for the 'walls'

Postby RogerS » 03 May 2019, 08:25

Thanks, Bob. Have to confess that I know very little about these, how they work, what I need to consider design-wise etc. Think that when I get back from hols I'll get some in from Ironmongery Direct and have a play. I do have a narrow stile mortice lock coming today from them.

Do you know what those door locks are called...the ones that are rebated into the edge of the closed door (in a double door scenario) ...top and bottom...and a lever that shoots a bolt within the lock (ie within the door rebate) into the top and bottom of the door frame ?
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Re: The Orangerie - time for the 'walls'

Postby will1983 » 03 May 2019, 08:34

It's called a lever action flush bolt mate.

Fitted one into a pair of double doors last weekend actually. freehand routered out the slot with the Katsu and then tidied up with a chisel, probably took about 25 mins start to finish.
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Re: The Orangerie - time for the 'walls'

Postby 9fingers » 03 May 2019, 08:35

That description fits my understanding of a multipoint lock although the I've seen some that project claws from the vertical edge of the door too.
Look at some makers websites and of course YouTube and you should see a few differing types.
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Re: The Orangerie - time for the 'walls'

Postby RogerS » 03 May 2019, 08:39

Thanks Will.

I tried YouTube Bob but all I found were how to replace in upcoming doors and nothing showing the operation

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Re: The Orangerie - time for the 'walls'

Postby RogerS » 03 May 2019, 08:41

uPVC not upcoming

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Re: The Orangerie - time for the 'walls'

Postby 9fingers » 03 May 2019, 08:58

It does not matter what the door is made of it is the mechanism you want to look at.
I've certainly seen one maker of motor driven locks (that I will need for swmbo) that had several videos on the details.
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Re: The Orangerie - time for the 'walls'

Postby 9fingers » 03 May 2019, 09:54

Lots of brands represented here
https://www.aldridgesecurity.co.uk/mult ... units.html

Shoot bolts are often an accessory to a multipoint lock as an alternative to edge locking devices.
I think you have a choice when there are a pair of doors.
A Manual shoot bolts on the secondary door and MPL plus edge locking or shoot bolt locking on the primary door.
B MPL and shoot bolts in both doors to effectively give you a pair of independent doors that happen to close against each other but are otherwise not connected.

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Re: The Orangerie - time for the 'walls'

Postby RogerS » 03 May 2019, 10:28

Thanks Bob...good site.
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Re: The Orangerie - time for the 'walls'

Postby Coley » 03 May 2019, 19:51

Wood it be a bad thing if you had a main pair of doors with perhaps an espag, then the rest have just ordinary sliding bolts...if necessary. With a wiping seal even if there were a bit of twist the draughstrip should still keep the elements out.

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Re: The Orangerie - time for the 'walls'

Postby Jonathan » 04 May 2019, 14:07

Rodger, for multipoint locks I've had good experience using VBH....they are geared up for supplying the trade so there web site is not good ......if you call technical they have guys that have more knowledge than the manufacturers......
They got me going when I was a multipoint virgin......now I wouldn't use anything else.

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Re: The Orangerie - time for the 'walls'

Postby RogerS » 04 May 2019, 14:24

Jonathan wrote:Rodger, for multipoint locks I've had good experience using VBH....they are geared up for supplying the trade so there web site is not good ......if you call technical they have guys that have more knowledge than the manufacturers......
They got me going when I was a multipoint virgin......now I wouldn't use anything else.

Jonathan

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Many thanks, Jonathan...although the phrase "multipoint virgin" conjures up all sorts of images ! :lol:
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