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Anyone know anything about motors ? ;-)

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Anyone know anything about motors ? ;-)

Postby Tusses » 18 Sep 2017, 18:26

appologies for not being about much ... broadband down for a week .. wife had a blow out on the motorway .. storm took a tree down and landed on 2 of my cars ! ... now elec troubles in the workshop ...

I have a book case to make .. fired up the compressor for the 1st time in a fair few months , for the nailer.

All good , until it got to pressure and clicked off. .. and tripped the RCD in the house (dedicated one for the workshop

reset the rcd .. got to pressure and tripped again ..

did this a few times, and now it trips when you switch it on.

Took the lid off, the filter cap had a broken leg .. didn't think this should cause the tripping, but went and got another to replace it , and it still trips.

with the compressor on, and the RCD switched on in the house, it clicks straight off, but if you hold the RCD for a sec, it stays on , the motor runs up to pressure then trips the RCD. :evil:

There's not a lot inside a compressor !
Brushes have lots of life in them.
Filter cap replaced
there is the pressure switch (now my main suspect)
and the on off switch . (seems ok.)

There is noticable sparking inside the motor casing on start up.
but runs fine if forced passed start up.

That's all the description I think I can give.

Typing this, has made me think to bypass the pressure switch (doh!!!)
and try it again.

Any other ideas ?

No hurry now, as I've dug out my old compressor to get the job finished.

and .. it's a real pain testing and tripping and walking back to the house to reset and walking back to the workshop (about 50m) .. the fun soon wears off ! :lol:


when it tripped .. it took out my windows PC which runs the laser .. so I'm on that tonight .. grrr ! lol

Thanks in advance and all that :-)
Tusses
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Re: Anyone know anything about motors ? ;-)

Postby 9fingers » 18 Sep 2017, 20:36

Nah! I know nothing about em at all. :lol:

Although I know you generally know which way is up but a couple of basic question before we chase the wrong wild goose.

Are you sure this has a brush motor? Very very unusual for something that needs relatively low speed and lots of starting torque to use a universal motor.

Are you sure it is an RCD that is tripping not an MCB?

Currently on the road in France dependent on hotel wifi which is good tonight but not every night!

Bob
Information on induction motors here
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1dBTVXx ... sp=sharing
Email:motors@minchin.org.uk
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Re: Anyone know anything about motors ? ;-)

Postby Tusses » 18 Sep 2017, 20:53

9fingers wrote:Nah! I know nothing about em at all. :lol:

Although I know you generally know which way is up but a couple of basic question before we chase the wrong wild goose.

Are you sure this has a brush motor? Very very unusual for something that needs relatively low speed and lots of starting torque to use a universal motor.

Are you sure it is an RCD that is tripping not an MCB?

Currently on the road in France dependent on hotel wifi which is good tonight but not every night!

Bob


As I said .. no hurry :-) .. you enjoy france ! .. I'll put some photo's up , as I think the motor and pump setup is ridiculous ! .. kind of like a £4.99 car tyre pump !

This is another SIP .. same time as I bought the SIP dust extractor that is OS :twisted:

I shan't be buying SIP again ! :lol:
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Re: Anyone know anything about motors ? ;-)

Postby Tusses » 18 Sep 2017, 20:57

just had a quick look at the breaker .. RCBO 30mA
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Re: Anyone know anything about motors ? ;-)

Postby Tusses » 18 Sep 2017, 20:58

and the compressor has worked fine before, with TS and extractors running too
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Re: Anyone know anything about motors ? ;-)

Postby 9fingers » 18 Sep 2017, 21:22

Grr
An RCBO is a mix of MCB and RCD such that you can't tell which problem caused the trip.
None of the above should allow you to hold it to stop it tripping. This is to stop people taping them up.

Sounds like you need to crawl through all the electrical steps and eliminate any hint of leakage current to earth first and then see it it trips which will point to overcurrent being the problem.

Bob
Information on induction motors here
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1dBTVXx ... sp=sharing
Email:motors@minchin.org.uk
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Re: Anyone know anything about motors ? ;-)

Postby Tusses » 18 Sep 2017, 21:55

9fingers wrote:Sounds like you need to crawl through all the electrical steps and eliminate any hint of leakage current to earth first and then see it it trips which will point to overcurrent being the problem.

Bob


yep .. that's why I posted it up .. to see if there were any ideas before I start.

I did test by switching all the heavy stuff on .. and it was fine, so I don't think , over current is the problem.

Plus I need to be sure there are no other problems , causing the RCD to be "on the edge" most of the time.
I'll dig out the silly scope , and see how clean it looks.

The armoured cable and RCBO was pre me.
A bit under powered TBH , and it's a long run.

But It's done the job for the 13 yrs we've been here.


ho hum ! .. the worst part is the walk back to the house to reset every time I test something ! :lol:


Got the windows PC back up BTW .. chkdsk fixed it.
simple enough
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Re: Anyone know anything about motors ? ;-)

Postby RogerS » 19 Sep 2017, 08:27

Tusses wrote:.....
The armoured cable and RCBO was pre me. A bit under powered TBH , and it's a long run
......



Oh boy....do I know ALL about that scenario. :cry:
If opportunity doesn't knock, build a door.
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Re: Anyone know anything about motors ? ;-)

Postby Tusses » 19 Sep 2017, 11:11

9fingers wrote:Sounds like you need to crawl through all the electrical steps and eliminate any hint of leakage current to earth first and then see it it trips which will point to overcurrent being the problem.

Bob


Just thinking out loud

If I isolate it from the floor , and disconnect the earth , that should show if it's earth leak or over current ?
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Re: Anyone know anything about motors ? ;-)

Postby 9fingers » 19 Sep 2017, 18:07

AND isolate it from you!!

Yes but only for the purposes of a test, Never a solution.

Bob
Information on induction motors here
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1dBTVXx ... sp=sharing
Email:motors@minchin.org.uk
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Re: Anyone know anything about motors ? ;-)

Postby Tusses » 19 Sep 2017, 18:15

9fingers wrote:AND isolate it from you!!

Yes but only for the purposes of a test, Never a solution.

Bob


haha .. yes .. we must state the obvious for anyone else reading !

I'm pretty sure it's not over current. That usually trips the breakers in the workshop .
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Re: Anyone know anything about motors ? ;-)

Postby Tusses » 19 Sep 2017, 18:21

This is the motor with brushes showing .. the plasic bit is approx 3" dia and 4.5" long for size ref.
It's stupidly small ! as is the piston

Image
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