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MOT

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MOT

Postby 9fingers » 25 Oct 2014, 13:24

It was MOT time today for my Pug405 estate - nearly 20 years old and I've had it from about 9months.

True to form it sailed through all the tests apart from rear fogs and number plate illumination both of which were working yesterday :evil:

I always use the same tester and act as his assistant during the test and we trust each other so he gave me a pass knowing that I'd sort it out.

Got home and studied the wiring diagram and as both items are on the moving tailgate, I concluded the only common electrical feature would be the earth return.
So out with a long length of cable, connected one end to the -ve terminal on the battery and the other bared read as a roving ground to test the circuits. Off with the all the light covers and lo and behold it is all working.


:evil: :evil:

Now I can't make it go wrong despite wiggling everything in sight, open and closing the tail gate, taking it for a drive etc etc - still OK.

Now for the interesting one - non MOT related.

Sometimes, if I engage reverse gear, the head lights and sidelights come on in dim-dip mode and then stay on (even with all lighting switched off) until I turn off the engine. Turn back on - lights off, engage reverse, and lights come on again.
Now that is a real puzzle..... for another day.

Normally I like puzzles but......

Bob
Information on induction motors here
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Email:motors@minchin.org.uk
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Re: MOT

Postby RogerS » 25 Oct 2014, 14:06

Could you have lost an earth on one or other of them? The reversing light circuit is always powered. Maybe it's feeding back through the headlamps effectively connecting them in series?

On a car lights question, does anyone know which car models come fitted with those automatic indicators? You know, the ones that automatically come on only when the car starts to turn into the side road. :cry:
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Re: MOT

Postby 9fingers » 25 Oct 2014, 16:48

The really curious thing is that it latches the lights on and I have yet to find what the "memory" element might be.

In practice, it is no big deal when it happens following a reversing manoeuvre, The dash lights come on, so once I am rolling forward, I can cut the ignition to clear the problem and then use the momentum of the car to re-start the engine quite smoothly.

One day I'll get to the bottom of it.


Bob
Information on induction motors here
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1dBTVXx ... sp=sharing
Email:motors@minchin.org.uk
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Re: MOT

Postby RogerS » 25 Oct 2014, 17:08

Locking relay?
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Re: MOT

Postby Andyp » 25 Oct 2014, 17:23

RogerS wrote:Could you have lost an earth on one or other of them? The reversing light circuit is always powered. Maybe it's feeding back through the headlamps effectively connecting them in series?

On a car lights question, does anyone know which car models come fitted with those automatic indicators? You know, the ones that automatically come on only when the car starts to turn into the side road. :cry:


Don't start me off on indicators. Over here I am convinced that they do not need to be working to pass the MOT (Controle technique).
As a helpful tip for anyone driving over here do not expect anyone to indicate on a roundabout and if they do then do not expect them to move in the direction they are indicating :evil:
I do not think therefore I do not am.

cheers
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Re: MOT

Postby kirkpoore1 » 28 Oct 2014, 15:16

Bob:

Your lighting problems are typical of electrical grounding problems. I've had all kinds of weird stuff happen on my trailer (nicknamed the IOTD, Instrument Of The Devil), including the regular lights coming on when the brake lights alone should have gone on, when the ground wire prong on the connector has been dirty. I would actually check the negative terminal on your battery and make sure it's clean.

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Re: MOT

Postby Rod » 28 Oct 2014, 17:33

Not that I know much about electrics other what I was taught at University but car electrics are not easy to understand?
My previous BMW 5-Series Touring developed a problem where on switching on it gave a message that the electrics had been switched off to save battery power.
Checking on a forum revealed that it was a faulty sensor from the filler cap that gave the wrong reports - disconnected and problem solved.

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Re: MOT

Postby chataigner » 29 Oct 2014, 08:51

9fingers wrote:The really curious thing is that it latches the lights on and I have yet to find what the "memory" element might be.

In practice, it is no big deal when it happens following a reversing manoeuvre, The dash lights come on, so once I am rolling forward, I can cut the ignition to clear the problem and then use the momentum of the car to re-start the engine quite smoothly.

One day I'll get to the bottom of it.


Bob


Could the latching effect be the reduction in resistance of the reversing light bulb when it has been heated while powered up for real - then when you shift out of reverse the flow back through the other lamps is enough to keep it hot ? Try taking the bulb(s) out and see if it still latches ?
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Re: MOT

Postby 9fingers » 29 Oct 2014, 10:44

Thanks for all the support/suggestions folks. I've got lots of other jobs on the go at the moment which are either more pressing or more interesting than crawling around in the car. It is very much our second car (20 years old rather than 10years like the other one). Both are through their MOT tests now and possibly won't get much TLC until the spring now unless anything serious goes wrong.

A vast proportion of electrics problems boil down to loss of earth return or apparently un-related blown fuses leading to leakage back through filaments so I'm pretty sure that is what it will be. this car is not very electronic apart from the engine management but they have used little bits of diode logic in the switching as an added hazard to the unwary!

Cheers

Bob
Information on induction motors here
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1dBTVXx ... sp=sharing
Email:motors@minchin.org.uk
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Re: MOT

Postby Mike G » 29 Oct 2014, 11:08

9fingers wrote:It was MOT time today for my Pug405 estate - nearly 20 years old and I've had it from about 9months.

True to form it sailed through all the tests apart from rear fogs and number plate illumination both of which were working yesterday :evil:

I always use the same tester and act as his assistant during the test and we trust each other so he gave me a pass knowing that I'd sort it out.

Got home and studied the wiring diagram and as both items are on the moving tailgate, I concluded the only common electrical feature would be the earth return.
So out with a long length of cable, connected one end to the -ve terminal on the battery and the other bared read as a roving ground to test the circuits. Off with the all the light covers and lo and behold it is all working.


:evil: :evil:

Now I can't make it go wrong despite wiggling everything in sight, open and closing the tail gate, taking it for a drive etc etc - still OK.

Now for the interesting one - non MOT related.

Sometimes, if I engage reverse gear, the head lights and sidelights come on in dim-dip mode and then stay on (even with all lighting switched off) until I turn off the engine. Turn back on - lights off, engage reverse, and lights come on again.
Now that is a real puzzle..... for another day.

Normally I like puzzles but......

Bob


[sucks air in through teeth] Dodgy earth, mate, dodgy earth.
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Re: MOT

Postby RogerS » 29 Oct 2014, 11:29

It's a French car....what else would you expect ? :lol:
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Re: MOT

Postby 9fingers » 29 Oct 2014, 12:34

I've invariably had Fords over the years and been very happy with them MkII cortina onwards but then I went for a vauxhall in the 80s and it was terrible. When I had the chance of a personal plate, I needed an M reg (or newer) vehicle to put it on and got the Peugeot and it has been excellent - does not owe me anything over the near 20 years I've had it.
Latest car is back to Ford (CMax) but still like the pug and it keeps on passing MOTs.

Cheers
Bob
Information on induction motors here
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1dBTVXx ... sp=sharing
Email:motors@minchin.org.uk
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