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Dans Shed - Large(ish) workshop construction...

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Re: Dans Shed - Large(ish) workshop construction...

Postby RogerS » 14 Aug 2015, 11:24

Dan0741 wrote:
RogerS wrote:You're lucky with your soil, Dan. If it was clay (like ours) then there is only one sure way of getting rid of excess water. An open ditch.



Its got some clay in it! Hoping its good enough -winter will let me know!


Well, fingers crossed for you. I am not a fan of French drains because in my experience, sure the membrane stops soil finings entering the pipework or gravel but you end up with the finings sitting on top of the membrane thus creating a pretty good impermeable membrane! Then later on, the stone/gravel gets filled up/silted up and so the French drain stops working.

Like you we have runoff onto our property from this farm track. And this farm track gets runoff from the hill behind and so when the monsoons came we soon knew all about it.

Image

So while I was having some hard landscaping done I got a very large 15" or so diameter pipe laid which feeds into a proper 6" yellow land drain pipe that takes the water away to the stream further down the hill. Along the fence line we have an open ditch that feeds the large pipe.The guy doing the work recommended putting down that soppy membrane and even put some over the end of the pipe at the ditch.
Image
A few months later, we had the monsoon to end all monsoons and I went outside to find the back awash with 3-6" of water, a cascade coming down the bank, mole holes spouting water 3 ft in the air. Why? That soppy membrane was stopping the water flow. I ripped it all away, there was an almighty sound of rushing water as the ditch emptied itself in seconds.

Sorry..slight hijack there !
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Re: Dans Shed - Large(ish) workshop construction...

Postby Dan0741 » 14 Aug 2015, 12:45

Don't think that's a hijack! .....But it is a boggy track!

Well I hope it all works! Its taken me ages, and cost a fortune! I don't think the scale of my water problem is the same as yours and I am no expert so I followed the advice I was could get my hands on. Ultimately the pipe and membrane down the middle is polish, the amount of water I get should percolate effectively though the gravel alone - if I am honest the bit I am unsure about is if the soakaways will disperse the quantity of water that I will have, its a fine balancing act between excessive drainage and cost and a dryish slab. My solution is for a bit of damp ground that I didn't want to affect the slab and yours seems an agricultural type format. As I said in my post, the water only ever pools on the patio during freak weather events once or twice a year so I thought that what I have done is way in excess of what was needed. Even in winter the lawn in that area didn't pool it just became a bit soft.

My water plan for the shed roof is still in development. Current iteration is that I will have roof drainage into a large galvanised trough - 2x2x10 feet which I will use to irrigate the veg beds. I want something I can dip a watering can into. This will hold quite a quantity and will have an overflow into the soakaway. I did think of some 1000 litre IBC behind the shed and a pump system but im not currently sure of the supply/demand aspects of the water system. Ie will I get enough water to make this viable in the summer months (today not being a typical example!) Basically I just want to use the water I get off the roof 7x4m usefully and avoid costs that are only ever going to increase... any suggestions gratefully received.

Because of the slope, if the drainage doesn't work as I said I have the option already dug in to feed to mains drainage, but obviously that becomes complicated....another option was tip my son out every weekend over the winter with a 50m hosepipe and syphon instructions!
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Re: Dans Shed - Large(ish) workshop construction...

Postby Commander » 14 Aug 2015, 13:16

Looking good so far, i will keep an eye on this one!
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Re: Dans Shed - Large(ish) workshop construction...

Postby MCLUMA » 14 Aug 2015, 15:18

Its looking good,

what float did you use on the concrete?
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Re: Dans Shed - Large(ish) workshop construction...

Postby Dan0741 » 14 Aug 2015, 15:30

MCLUMA wrote:Its looking good,

what float did you use on the concrete?


Skip float- so I was told - I had a bloke in to manage the process as a pump was involved - he told me it would be perfect save a line down the middle - it isn't that good but plenty good enough for my needs...

A tense day!

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Re: Dans Shed - Large(ish) workshop construction...

Postby MCLUMA » 14 Aug 2015, 18:40

pouring concrete is the most stressful thing in your life, even getting children, - being there at birth - is that stressful

however, having said that, i now no longer use ready mixed concrete trucks, as these truck drivers are not worth living.

I use now these people that mix on site, with the big trucks, not the ones they shovel everything in the mixer on the back but these big 8 wheelers. they wait while you work, and get a super finish, no rush, at all, and they do not mind waiting for the next wheel barrow to arrive. you only pay what you use, not like with these big companies, where they just dump on your drive anything that has not been used.

as you understand from above, i had my share of experience of the big companies

the worst one was when on a 6 truck concrete job, they forgot to send the last 2 trucks, they had already gone home at 3 o clock on friday, - You can understand the frustration

I have in the coming weeks another garage floor to do 8 by 5 and was thinking of hiring a powerfloat to get a super smooth finish
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Re: Dans Shed - Large(ish) workshop construction...

Postby Rod » 14 Aug 2015, 19:15

I'm sure if you had advice you are going about it the right way.
I used to know all the formulas for run-offs, soakaways etc but have long forgotten them.
(1" of rain over the flood plain or something like that??)
French drains work well if properly designed, constructed and built in the correct place though may need some maintenance in the future?
Time will tell

Watching the WIP with interest.

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Re: Dans Shed - Large(ish) workshop construction...

Postby Dan0741 » 17 Aug 2015, 20:47

OK, so have been thinking re the build, and am after any pointers or guidance that anyone may have. I have an exam I am studying for in Oct so there will be a pause between now and then whilst I do the revision I should have done already! But it does provide thinking time..

The plinth – I intend to use hollow concrete blocks - the ones that are 150mm wide. There will only be one course of these and I will screw some nuts on the J bolts already set in the slab to give them some grip and pour concrete into the holes in the blocks so that the J bolts fix the plinth to the slab. I will then set more J bolts in the concrete in the holes in the top of the plinth to fix the sole plate to with a DPM in between - then fix the frame to the sole plate.

Any observations/errors with this?

The wall construction… I want to build a timber frame with 4x2, I will make this in several smaller parts so I can handle them on my own, and fix together. I have (obtained free) some insulation celotex (or similar) insulation panels that I will be inserting between the studs. I intend to put OSB on the outside of this for the sheathing and then building paper, battens (and hence 25mm air gap) and then shiplap or TG on the battens. On the inside I intend to use reclaimed wooden boards (similar to but not pallet wood) to line the inside of the stud wall, because this will look better and I intend to mix up the types so the overall effect will be good I think. This also means if I want to add anything inside or change it I can, also fit extra wires etc I can do that without it being too much of a chore, I can remove a board and refit.
Questions - Is this a sensible wall construction - I intend to use all year round and heat this in the winter with a stove. OSB – does it need to be OSB 3 (will be covered by building paper) and of a particular thickness? Cost is an issue but also weight, I will be doing the job on my own so installing the thicker sheets will be harder work. I note some constructions have OSB on the inside – I don’t want this for the reasons given above but accept it is structurally required in the overall makeup.

Last wall framing question – I intend to put a 5/6 foot wide door in one end. How big will my header need to be – will x2 4x2 with a ply insert do it or will it need to be bigger. I intend to put a (fairly) hefty roof on it made of 6x2 rafters, but will get to the roof design next week!
Any observations good/bad gratefully received Gents.

Cheers

Dan
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Re: Dans Shed - Large(ish) workshop construction...

Postby Mike G » 18 Aug 2015, 08:36

Dan,

concrete blocks will always look like concrete blocks. You'll improve your overall look many-fold by using bricks instead. There is nothing difficult about laying bricks, and you'll be pleased you did it whereas for ever after you'll be looking at those blocks..........

Now, the walls. I did a thread many years ago on some other forum somewhere called Build a Shed Mike's Way, or something like that. That has a reasonable drawing of the wall arrangements, and is well worth a look. Otherwise, have a look at my workshop thread here. It is absolutely essential to have your OSB on the correct side of the insulation.......the inside. Not the outside. The thing is, OSB (like ply, but more so) contains a huge amount of glue, and is virtually vapour-impermeable. It would be like putting a vapour barrier around the outside of a building, rather than inside. The warmed air inside the building holds more water vapour than the cold air outside, which will condense on the (cold) inside face of the OSB. You will get damp and mould, and eventually even rot, within your wall structure if you put the OSB where you propose. The OSB can be 10mm. You might get away with 6mm if you do studs at 400 centres.

Your lintel should be doubled up 6x2s if spanning 5/6 feet.

A further point about your frame design. On a shed like this you can have studs at 600 centres. However, you must double-up around openings. You then have a choice of either placing your rafters directly over your stud locations, or doubling up the top plate and being free to put your rafters anywhere.

Please reconsider your wall design. It's a really nice idea to line the inside with timber as you propose, but you really shouldn't line the outside with OSB. An alternative is to build in some diagonal bracing to all your walls, and omit the OSB altogether. There is quite a lot more work in this though.

Finally, I never like to see anything piercing the DPC. It is easy to run straps up the plinth and over the plate, or perhaps align them with the studs and fix them to the face of those. It is poor practice to just bolt down through the DPC. Strapping is actually far less important than people imagine. My previous workshop was about 6 metres by 4 metres, and when I moved out I discovered that I had overlooked fixing the straps to the wall (they were cast into the concrete base). The building was just sitting there under the weight of gravity.....and hadn't moved a millimetre in 20 years.
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Re: Dans Shed - Large(ish) workshop construction...

Postby Deejay » 18 Aug 2015, 09:34

Morning all

I did a thread many years ago on some other forum somewhere called Build a Shed Mike's Way, or something like that.

It's still there Mike ...

http://www.ukworkshop.co.uk/forums/buil ... 39389.html

Cheers

Dave
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Re: Dans Shed - Large(ish) workshop construction...

Postby Dan0741 » 18 Aug 2015, 21:05

Mike G wrote:Dan,

concrete blocks will always look like concrete blocks. You'll improve your overall look many-fold by using bricks instead. There is nothing difficult about laying bricks, and you'll be pleased you did it whereas for ever after you'll be looking at those blocks..........

Now, the walls. I did a thread many years ago on some other forum somewhere called Build a Shed Mike's Way, or something like that. That has a reasonable drawing of the wall arrangements, and is well worth a look. Otherwise, have a look at my workshop thread here. It is absolutely essential to have your OSB on the correct side of the insulation.......the inside. Not the outside. The thing is, OSB (like ply, but more so) contains a huge amount of glue, and is virtually vapour-impermeable. It would be like putting a vapour barrier around the outside of a building, rather than inside. The warmed air inside the building holds more water vapour than the cold air outside, which will condense on the (cold) inside face of the OSB. You will get damp and mould, and eventually even rot, within your wall structure if you put the OSB where you propose. The OSB can be 10mm. You might get away with 6mm if you do studs at 400 centres.

Your lintel should be doubled up 6x2s if spanning 5/6 feet.

A further point about your frame design. On a shed like this you can have studs at 600 centres. However, you must double-up around openings. You then have a choice of either placing your rafters directly over your stud locations, or doubling up the top plate and being free to put your rafters anywhere.

Please reconsider your wall design. It's a really nice idea to line the inside with timber as you propose, but you really shouldn't line the outside with OSB. An alternative is to build in some diagonal bracing to all your walls, and omit the OSB altogether. There is quite a lot more work in this though.

Finally, I never like to see anything piercing the DPC. It is easy to run straps up the plinth and over the plate, or perhaps align them with the studs and fix them to the face of those. It is poor practice to just bolt down through the DPC. Strapping is actually far less important than people imagine. My previous workshop was about 6 metres by 4 metres, and when I moved out I discovered that I had overlooked fixing the straps to the wall (they were cast into the concrete base). The building was just sitting there under the weight of gravity.....and hadn't moved a millimetre in 20 years.


Thank you Mike – very grateful for the guidance.

Plinth - I’m still undecided about the blocks, but the plan was going to be to run battens down the full face of the wall including the blocks so they wouldn’t be seen, I’ve never laid a single brick and didn’t want to take the risk, after all it needs to be level and square to kick off the build. It looks like quite a skill! I understand the risks here that the plinth is designed to keep the wood away from the ground but wanted a single material on the wall, was toying with cedar and couldn’t really find any bricks that would work with the cedar silver colour once weathered. I’ve looked everywhere!

Walls – Understood re the OSB. I’m just keen to stick with the plank interior as whist very practical, and aesthetically pleasing it will be easy. I want to leave the flexibility to change things without a big issue and this seemed a way of doing it. Also should we move and the new owner wants to do something different with the space it will be easier. I have reviewed both threads now and see the OSB issue. Diagonal bracing option – if I applied extra timber to the outside of the structure, at a 45 degree angle would this resolve the structural issue caused by omitting the OSB? I could put them on 1000mm centres at 45 degrees across the whole wall. If yes, what size timber would this need to be, not huge I imagine as its only doing the work that the OSB would be doing. Structural issues aside – does the OSB provide any other function that I would be losing? I’m just conscious that in my plan my OSB replacement has considerable gaps. I understand I would have to makeup fillets to place on the studs to make it up to the same profile as the braces so as to enable install of the battens. I would put the building paper over the bracing and under the battens before putting the T/G on?

Ultimately I would like to retain the plank idea, but not at the risk of condensation forming in the wall structure.

Going to do studs at 600 centres as that is the size insulation I have. Will double up the studs in places, I’m framing in sections anyway – and put full window/door framing in – cripple/trimmer/header etc. Will double up the top plate.

DPC – I read extensively on this – I worried about piercing the DPC and it seemed silly to pierce if avoidable but some online seem to think the DPC forms a watertight seal around the piercing – not a risk I want to take if the alternative is as easy anyway.

Thank you for taking the time to point me in the right direction on these issues Mike,

Cheers

Dan
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Re: Dans Shed - Large(ish) workshop construction...

Postby Dan0741 » 18 Aug 2015, 21:15

Deejay wrote:Morning all

I did a thread many years ago on some other forum somewhere called Build a Shed Mike's Way, or something like that.

It's still there Mike ...

http://www.ukworkshop.co.uk/forums/buil ... 39389.html

Cheers

Dave


Cheers Dave - its gold dust to those learning the ropes!

Dan
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Re: Dans Shed - Large(ish) workshop construction...

Postby Wizard9999 » 18 Aug 2015, 22:17

Dan

I recently built a workshop very much following Mike's way of doing it. So if you don't mind a few comments / observations on your current thinking. Unfortunately due to a technical issue my thread charting the early phases of construction was lost, but I have dropped a few pictures in below to try and illustrate.

Plinth
With respect to Mike, like so many things I guess, it is fine to say laying bricks is easy when you have done it a lot and know what you are doing. I used blocks for my workshop and like you it was my first effort at laying anything, it was not at all easy for me, anything but frankly. Getting mortar the right consistency every time, keeping it level and keeping it straight were all challenges. I know, I know, run string lines, but when it's new it still isn't easy. Now I have never been a natural DIYer, maybe you have a better track record. My build was on a restricted site and two of the walls were part below ground (sloping site), your site looks more accessible. My workshop is also fairly tucked away so aesthetic considerations were not key, your workshop looks like it will be more in the open. Finally, I understand blocks are heavier than bricks, so to some extent can be considered harder to lay in one respect. All of these differences may mean you could go for brick, but I would say that my experience is not that the process of laying is easy.
Image
The bricks ontop of planks up against the wall was trying to hold it straight up, but it didn't work, I really winced when the fram went on this section of wall, but it did at least stay up.

Straps of DPC
Brilliant idea, worked perfectly on my workshop. What I did was to lay the bottom coarse of blocks on top of the straps and then fold them up and over the top of the sole plate, visible in picture above as I built walls, this is then how they are fixed.
Image

Wall structure
Time will tell if I got anything horribly wrong, but the OSB on the inside of my walls worked well. Oh and don't forget the insect mesh at the bottom of the cladding, since starting work in my workshop I can't believe how many wasps have taken an interest in it, convinced they would be considering nesting if they cold get into the walls / roof.
Image

But, most important of all, having spent the best part of twelve months building my workshop I now spend time in it nearly every day, well worth all the blood, sweat and tears.

All the best and good luck with the studies!

Terry.
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Re: Dans Shed - Large(ish) workshop construction...

Postby Rod » 18 Aug 2015, 23:13

Don't wish to encroach this thread too much but I'm planning a shed rebuild - but this is going to be a shed - just for storing things.
Can you use roof breather membrane for walls. I've been trying to source a small roll of the stuff (not a 100m x 1.5 that full rolls come in)
Part rolls of the roof type seem fairly common on the bay?

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Re: Dans Shed - Large(ish) workshop construction...

Postby Wizard9999 » 19 Aug 2015, 10:01

Rod wrote:Don't wish to encroach this thread too much but I'm planning a shed rebuild - but this is going to be a shed - just for storing things.
Can you use roof breather membrane for walls. I've been trying to source a small roll of the stuff (not a 100m x 1.5 that full rolls come in)
Part rolls of the roof type seem fairly common on the bay?

Rod


Rod

I used this and you can see it is clearly stated to be for roofing.
Image
I do seem to recall looking at the manufacturer's specs though to confirm it could be used on walls. Can't believe this brand is unique.

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Re: Dans Shed - Large(ish) workshop construction...

Postby Mike G » 19 Aug 2015, 19:02

Dan0741 wrote:........... Diagonal bracing option – if I applied extra timber to the outside of the structure, at a 45 degree angle would this resolve the structural issue caused by omitting the OSB? I could put them on 1000mm centres at 45 degrees across the whole wall. If yes, what size timber would this need to be..........


I would have suggested using a diagonal 4x2 (laid flat) within the line of the studs, and cutting all your studs diagonally to meet the brace........or, letting a piece of 4x1 into the face of the studs, but I really can't see a problem with what you suggest. So, if you want to brace in the battened-out zone on the outside of the studs you need 4x1, and it should go from virtually the top of the corner stud down to the plate at 45 degree or less. The longer it can be, the better. It should be nailed with 2 65mm nails at each stud it crosses, and there should ideally be 2 braces on each face of your building, one at each corner. It always gets interesting around openings, and you may have to compromise. You'll be amazed how profoundly strong even a single brace makes a wall. To be properly effective, any joins in your plate should either be scarfed, or should have a piece of timber nailed across the top, so that the plate acts as one if subject to any horizontal force.

You most certainly do not need parallel braces as you suggest.

Obviously, this bracing is in the battened out zone, outside your breather membrane. Obviously it must be treated timber, and you have to think carefully about the detail at both ends so that it doesn't interfere with airflow, insect mesh etc. I would suggest that the battens you fix above your bracing should have a small gap (say 10mm) so that any moisture that ever penetrated your cladding would roll down the top edge of the brace, and drop out of the bottom of the void, rather than getting stuck against a vertical which could result in eventual rot.
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Re: Dans Shed - Large(ish) workshop construction...

Postby Dan0741 » 19 Aug 2015, 21:55

Terry,

Thanks for your post, it’s all very helpful, and seeing the work of others is quite confidence inspiring that if I think things through I will end up with the building im after like you have.

Bricklaying – The more I think about this, do you know the more I think I might have a go! It all looks quite straightforward online anyway, im sure it’s a skill that comes with years of experience but im only thinking of 3 courses so how wrong can it go if I take it slow and plan it?(!) My biggest issue with this is trying to find a brick colour that suits the weathered cedar im planning, any ideas? I do need to be careful with the looks of it as it will be directly opposite the house in the back garden and I will see it every time I look out onto the back garden.

Mine is also a sloping garden, about 1 in 20 slope down from the shed towards the house, and hence built into the ground – at the rear by about 8 inches, I plan to do the french drain/shingle thing, and build a sort of step back from the eternal wall by about a foot and plant some sleepers there as a sort of 6 inch retaining wall.

I will go with the straps idea, it all makes sense, and as I have a dpm under my slab I can turn the edge of it under the first course. Given I have never layed bricks I always wonder how the first course of bricks ‘sticks’ to the slab as it will have a dpm separating it? One would think that the bricks would move if on a plastic sheet as they have nothing to ‘stick’ to?

The shed you have come up with looks great overall despite the challenges, what did you put on the outside?

Thanks for your views – its invaluable to hear from those that have been there before me!

Cheers,

Dan
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Re: Dans Shed - Large(ish) workshop construction...

Postby Wizard9999 » 19 Aug 2015, 23:07

Dan

More power to your elbow, I wasn't trying to put you off brick laying, just wanted you to understand that at least one novice hasn't found it easy.

The standard 'Mike way' to build is for the slab to sit about 50mm above finished ground level, this then allows it to breath so no wrapping DPM over. But due to the site I only did this on two sides of my shed. On the other two the shed walls act as retaining walls because of the higher ground level. For those two retaining walls I wrapped the DPM over the slab and under the first course of blocks, it then went up between the middle of the inner and outer block skins and lapped over the outer skin under the DPM. It was only on these two walls that I did a doule skin of blockwork. This effectively created a single 'tanking' barrier from under the slab to a point well above ground. I recall no problem with the block work sitting on the DPM, but I was using heavy blocks so they exerted a fair degree of downward force just with gravity and I am not sure if a much lighter brick would do this. This is especially the case in the corners where the DPM is unavoidably pleated in some way to fold over whilst oing around a corner. This picture may make my description a bit clearer.
Image

To repeat a picture I posted before in this one you can see the DPM between the two skins in the wall in front of the fence. The inner skin was those light weight aerated blocks.
Image

Looking back I think you must be going for a pitched roof as you mention a 4m over all height, if this is the case this point may not be of so much interest. I used the slope on my site to my advantage, because I wanted to maximise height, having read the detail of the regulations (not just the summary on the planning portal) I saw that the 2.5m limit when within 2m of the boundary is based of the highest point of natural ground next to the building. As the back of my workshop is next to ground which is 30cm higher than the front I used this as my datum, even though my roof pitches up to the front. The result is if you measure at the front the roof would seem to be at 2.8m from the ground. The devil, as they say, is in the detail.

I have clad with bog standard pre-treated feather edge board. As I said before this is tucked away out of most people's view and so aesthetics are not the number 1 priority.

All the best,
Terry.
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Re: Dans Shed - Large(ish) workshop construction...

Postby Dan0741 » 21 Aug 2015, 21:42

Hi all – Been ruminating on the wall design today and can help thinking that the OSB on the inside would be so much simpler! But I think I will follow the advice above from Mike G re letting a piece of 4x1 into the studs, it will be fairly straightforward to do once the frame is up. It also keeps it all behind the breather membrane and avoids the resultant complications. Can see the openings being a bit of a chore but should be able to squeeze something in around them.

Nails/Screws – Does it matter? Im in no hurry so the speed of a gun isn’t really too much of a benefit to me, and as it will be constructed over weeks/months when I can fit it in… hiring one isn’t practical for that reason. Is one more structurally sound than the other? Opinion seems divided on the net in general.

Ive asked a mate who used to do a bit of bricklaying in the past if I should try it – he reckons no and that I will make a mess of it! Confidence inspiring isn’t it! Cheeky git. Still undecided.

Terry – Your explanation of the DPM is comprehensive and I will be doing something similar - it’s the nature of a build that evolves over several months/years in the mind that some decisions affect others, when I was building a `shed’ all this talk of DPM and plinth walls was irrelevant – it’s not now a shed and that has affected the plan around this aspect more than any other part I think – the roof will be the next issue! Those trees are whoppers next to your build - not worried the roots will affect your slab/wall? Bet they have TPO’s don’t they? Smart move with the max height issue - you are right that the detail is useful – That extra bit of height will have come in very useful when restricted to the 2.5 level I bet. I was originally planning to be under that but when I did the calculations – it wasn’t going to give me any type of roof slope and I do want a decent pitch.

I engaged in some study avoidance today and started digging out the trench at the rear of the slab for gravel and drain, and whilst doing so found a couple of little beauties, firstly an enormous caterpillar 3 inches long and then a bright pink moth. I did some research on line and found out that it’s an Elephant hawk moth caterpillar and also the actual moth, quite unusual I thought!

Image

Image

Image

Cheers,

Dan
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Re: Dans Shed - Large(ish) workshop construction...

Postby Andyp » 21 Aug 2015, 22:14

Nails are fine if you get it right first time every time, but make a mistake.... Screws are expensive but you can take it down and put it back as often as you want. I hate nails but then I seldom get it right :oops:
I do not think therefore I do not am.

cheers
Andy
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Re: Dans Shed - Large(ish) workshop construction...

Postby Dan0741 » 21 Aug 2015, 22:28

Love it - I recently replaced a window sill - and when cutting to size accidentally cut off too much requiring a visit back to Wicks for a new board. It came up in conversation with one of the ladies at work. She was on her way to make T and as she passed me she said `measure twice - cut once` I nearly pi**ed myself with laughter!
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Re: Dans Shed - Large(ish) workshop construction...

Postby Wizard9999 » 21 Aug 2015, 22:42

Dan0741 wrote:Nails/Screws – Does it matter? Im in no hurry so the speed of a gun isn’t really too much of a benefit to me, and as it will be constructed over weeks/months when I can fit it in… hiring one isn’t practical for that reason. Is one more structurally sound than the other? Opinion seems divided on the net in general.
Dan

In my case Dan I nailed the frame, I'll hopefully never see it again. For fitting the OSB on the inside screws, because I might want to mess around with that. Featheredge cladding was nails, no way I was screwing that and whilst it may destroy the board I can get that off even after nailing if I really need to.

Dan0741 wrote:Ive asked a mate who used to do a bit of bricklaying in the past if I should try it – he reckons no and that I will make a mess of it! Confidence inspiring isn’t it! Cheeky git. Still undecided.
Dan

What is it they say "a pessimist is what an optimist calls a realist". So is your friend a pessimist or a realist? ;)

Dan0741 wrote:Those trees are whoppers next to your build - not worried the roots will affect your slab/wall? Bet they have TPO’s don’t they?
Dan

They certainly are! Advice from Mike is the slab will move being that close, but there is so much steel in that slab it is very unlikely it will do anything other than move in a single piece. Fortunately they didn't have TPOs when I built the workshop, or I would have been in trouble given my axe work on the roots. But they do now as it happens, after I prevailed on the council to protect them in a bid to put a spanner in the works of developers trying to build in the field behind me.

All the best,
Terry.
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Re: Dans Shed - Large(ish) workshop construction...

Postby Mike G » 22 Aug 2015, 10:32

Dan0741 wrote:.....Nails/Screws – Does it matter? Im in no hurry so the speed of a gun isn’t really too much of a benefit to me, and as it will be constructed over weeks/months when I can fit it in… hiring one isn’t practical for that reason. Is one more structurally sound than the other? Opinion seems divided on the net in general........


For constructing the frame, nails. The advantage of a nail gun over a hammer is that the bits of wood you are trying to fix together don't move as you hit the nail, which is a big annoyance when doing things manually. You could screw it, but you'd be talking quite a lot of 90mm+ screws, and some inconvenient positions to try to get to with you drill/ driver. Do-able, but pricey, and awkward at times.

For feather edge boards....65mm thin wire galv nails, one per board per stud. Do not use a nail gun, and only screw them in special circumstances.
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Re: Dans Shed - Large(ish) workshop construction...

Postby Dan0741 » 22 Aug 2015, 11:01

Cheers Mike - may try to do the frame in a few long days then - it then makes hiring a gun more reasonable. Im learning as I go so things just take me a bit longer as I think through problems etc... doing it for the first time always stakes a little bit longer, i can get all the wood sawn to size etc beforehand.

Im just thinking ahead re the roof, can you point me in the direction of a software package that I can try to draw it - im not particularly IT savvy, and I haven't drawn anything else but don't want to get the roof wrong for obvious reasons, and drawing it out seem like the best place to start.

http://www.blocklayer.com/Roof/Gable.aspx

Ive tried this one but it isn't brilliant..

I want to make sure I have thought it through before I do the frame so I have considered everything, otherwise changes start becoming costly...

Regards,

Dan
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Re: Dans Shed - Large(ish) workshop construction...

Postby Mike G » 22 Aug 2015, 13:16

Dan, give me you length & width across the plates and I'll draw it for you. Obviously I'll need to know which way it has to fall (slope down).
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