It is currently 28 Mar 2024, 16:02

Shed rebuild

Roll up, roll up. Here you will find everything from new workshop designs, through builds to completed workshop tours. All magnificently overseen by our own Mike G and his tremendously thorough 'Shed' design and generous advice.

Re: Shed rebuild

Postby 9fingers » 27 Aug 2018, 12:25

Could you cut your own firring strips by clamping a straight edge on at an angle and a circular saw?
Could you borrow a track saw?

Have we a member nearby with a decent table saw to help? Even careful work on bandsaw would be OK.
The strips don't have to be in one long length don't forget.

You can have the tops of the walls level if you must (?) and cover the sloping gap with wide fascia boards at the sides.

Bob
Information on induction motors here
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1dBTVXx ... sp=sharing
Email:motors@minchin.org.uk
User avatar
9fingers
Petrified Pine
 
Posts: 10038
Joined: 21 Jul 2014, 20:22
Location: Romsey Hampshire between Southampton and the New Forest
Name: Bob

Re: Shed rebuild

Postby RogerS » 27 Aug 2018, 12:47

Can you not simply put some packing pieces under one end of the rafters ?
If opportunity doesn't knock, build a door.
User avatar
RogerS
Petrified Pine
 
Posts: 13290
Joined: 21 Jul 2014, 21:07
Location: Nearly finished. OK OK...call me Pinocchio.
Name:

Re: Shed rebuild

Postby 9fingers » 27 Aug 2018, 13:19

RogerS wrote:Can you not simply put some packing pieces under one end of the rafters ?



T'would be the easy way but the OP said he wanted horizontal joists but not quite sure why.

I think the span is 4m and 1:40 fall would give good drainage. so that is 100mm to nothing for the firring.

Cutting 2 just over 1m pieces of 4x2, on to give 100 to 75 and 25 to nothing and the other 75 to 50 and 25 to 50 would do the job
NB need to adjust the cut sizes for real world dimensions and the saw kerf but the principle is there.

Bob
Information on induction motors here
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1dBTVXx ... sp=sharing
Email:motors@minchin.org.uk
User avatar
9fingers
Petrified Pine
 
Posts: 10038
Joined: 21 Jul 2014, 20:22
Location: Romsey Hampshire between Southampton and the New Forest
Name: Bob

Re: Shed rebuild

Postby Coolhands » 27 Aug 2018, 14:02

Ok maybe angled rafters are best. So I would need front header plate to be higher than rear? Small birdsmouth cuts on rafters? (I could work out the angles)

Or, how do I get the front header plate to be high enough compared with the rear?

Thanks. Back outside now! Trying to pack a quart into a pint pot
User avatar
Coolhands
New Shoots
 
Posts: 84
Joined: 03 Apr 2018, 20:39
Location: Edgware, London
Name:

Re: Shed rebuild

Postby 9fingers » 27 Aug 2018, 14:22

I'd use metal joist hangers and not mess around cutting your joist ends which will compromise strength.
EG toolstation 43424 or similar to suit your timber thickness.

Pop in a couple of screws to secure whilst you are tinkering with angles etc then you can take them out to adjust. Then either use more screws when you have it right or galvanised nails, skewing some into the walls for optimum strength.

Bob
Information on induction motors here
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1dBTVXx ... sp=sharing
Email:motors@minchin.org.uk
User avatar
9fingers
Petrified Pine
 
Posts: 10038
Joined: 21 Jul 2014, 20:22
Location: Romsey Hampshire between Southampton and the New Forest
Name: Bob

Re: Shed rebuild

Postby Mike G » 27 Aug 2018, 20:33

There's no great compromise on the strength with such a shallow birdsmouth. Site chippies most certainly wouldn't bother cutting the timbers in that circumstance, but if you can without too much trouble, it would be nice.

I don't understand the reference to firring pieces costing X amount of money......they are simply bits of 4x2 or 2x2 ripped into long wedge shapes, two per piece, with no great wastage. But frankly, unless you are desperate for a horizontal ceiling, I'd just raise the roof at one end. Oh, and with your span you definitely need 200 deep rafters, and ideally you'd have a fall of about 60/ 65mm.
User avatar
Mike G
Sequoia
 
Posts: 9833
Joined: 30 Jul 2014, 22:36
Location: Suffolk
Name:

Re: Shed rebuild

Postby Mike G » 27 Aug 2018, 20:37

Here's a photo of the shed I built a week or two back, showing the front plate 150 or 200 higher than the rear plate.

Image

Note that my roof timbers sat directly above the wall studs, so I only needed a single plate. If yours don't, then you'll need to double up the plates. If you want to build a green roof, then all bets are off........you'll need a structural engineer.
User avatar
Mike G
Sequoia
 
Posts: 9833
Joined: 30 Jul 2014, 22:36
Location: Suffolk
Name:

Re: Shed rebuild

Postby Coolhands » 02 Sep 2018, 18:41

Hi I have been busy disassembling the existing shed, see pic

Image

Image

I also had to build a gargantuan holder to hold all the insulation, which I've decided to reuse after much humming and erring. Decided it would be a waste of money to simply bin it then buy new in 2 months time

Image

I have 3 questions if someone could help

1) I have decided I want my shed to have 2 halves, ie separated by an internal wall. If I run a joist from this to the side walls, it can support the fore / aft joists midway along their length. In this case, will they be ok at 150mm deep as I will have halved their span to just over 1.8 meters?

2) if the above does allow the fore / aft joists to be 150mm deep, can the supporting joists (running from the mid wall to the side walls) also be 150mm? The span left to right will be about 2.2m however it will also be bearing the load of the other main rafters. In which case, can I double them up (join) and still have them as 150mm?

3) I've taken out a load of 2x3" timber from the original shed which was too skinny for the load. Before I chuck it all away (I've got serious site issues here managing space!!) is there anything you think I could / will ant to use it for? I'm thinking bin it as it's no good for joists or the walls, so what would I use it for. I've got too much junk around here wlaready so if I won't use it I want to get rid

Cheers!
User avatar
Coolhands
New Shoots
 
Posts: 84
Joined: 03 Apr 2018, 20:39
Location: Edgware, London
Name:

Re: Shed rebuild

Postby Mike G » 02 Sep 2018, 20:43

Could you post a sketch of your proposed joist layout, with the wall position shown. It's too ambiguous at the moment to give you an answer confidently.
User avatar
Mike G
Sequoia
 
Posts: 9833
Joined: 30 Jul 2014, 22:36
Location: Suffolk
Name:

Re: Shed rebuild

Postby RogerS » 02 Sep 2018, 21:28

Keep that insulation bone dry. Otherwise it will be useless.
If opportunity doesn't knock, build a door.
User avatar
RogerS
Petrified Pine
 
Posts: 13290
Joined: 21 Jul 2014, 21:07
Location: Nearly finished. OK OK...call me Pinocchio.
Name:

Re: Shed rebuild

Postby jules70 » 02 Sep 2018, 22:46

Put it in the wendy house - quick when the kids aren't looking !
jules70
Seedling
 
Posts: 42
Joined: 17 Jun 2016, 23:43
Name:

Re: Shed rebuild

Postby Coolhands » 02 Sep 2018, 23:23

sorry just trying to learn sketchup quickly!! Imagine the front wall does extend up to meet the inclined rafters! So it would rest on header plate front and rear, and sideways joist midway. I need to redraw whole thing but taking a while to get to grips with it.

Image

Plan view:

Image


front view:

Image
left view:

Image
User avatar
Coolhands
New Shoots
 
Posts: 84
Joined: 03 Apr 2018, 20:39
Location: Edgware, London
Name:

Re: Shed rebuild

Postby Coolhands » 11 Sep 2018, 21:12

Progress. 2 new fence panels (nearly 60 quid!) just cos it makes sense to do it now. Old ones were shot.

44570A62-2319-46EA-9A5B-B787BB2256E8.jpeg
(422.93 KiB)


Shed down, floor up, which was to be honest a pretty mammoth task all in all. Including unnailing all featherboard to reuse. Site clear and blocks laid to hand for brickie.

4A369F63-F2EA-42E9-9960-0CDA4709AFEC.jpeg
(412.62 KiB)


nice clear pic for him! Lol

EFC0B837-977A-4B08-AA9C-6217833CA6C4.jpeg
(218.46 KiB)


And then he did the business

695E7980-19F2-482D-9C5B-F894D8288604.jpeg
(289.8 KiB)


1482D358-64CD-4B5E-9019-40D4F87671A5.jpeg
(357.25 KiB)


Couldn’t afford Flemish bond as he wanted more money as it takes longer.

BBD2E8F0-11DB-4194-BCFD-678BD89C91C9.jpeg
(466.62 KiB)


Obviously as I’ve brickwork done it’s decided to rain tonight. So last minute scramble to cover up. It’s had about 6 hours since finished with no rain so I think it’ll be ok.

5D3A8567-756F-406C-B5C4-326A2AF38307.jpeg
(346.74 KiB)
User avatar
Coolhands
New Shoots
 
Posts: 84
Joined: 03 Apr 2018, 20:39
Location: Edgware, London
Name:

Re: Shed rebuild

Postby Coolhands » 16 Sep 2018, 22:16

finally started on the making, after spending ages calculating & recalculating the measurements. The sides slope gradually up the front so each stud is a different length; I've got about a 9 cm drop front to rear. Since I'm using all the original wood I'm trying to make sure I use the shortest lengths necessary for each piece and leaving the longer ones for the front elevation.

I'm making all the walls in 2 sections each to keep weight manageable. This is the first one (just propped up as a test fitting) & I've cut the mirror image for the other side.

the little piece sticking out is example of where the 150mm cross member is going to sit to support the rafters front to rear. It will be sandwiched between the next section of wall. I'm considering 'doubling up' that joist ie having double. Might be overkill though.

fullsizeoutput_80ad.jpeg
(167.95 KiB)


edit looking at that pic the cross member will be too low. Can't believe it I've planned, planned and re-planned this framework! Luckily not too late I can redesign! Possible I can just change that stud for one 47mm taller to raise the crossmember to roof joist (rafter?) level
User avatar
Coolhands
New Shoots
 
Posts: 84
Joined: 03 Apr 2018, 20:39
Location: Edgware, London
Name:

Re: Shed rebuild

Postby Coolhands » 25 Sep 2018, 00:00

I work in a school, so in preparation for when I seat my framing on a bed of mortar, I asked the DT technician about me making some simple folding wedges after hours with offcuts. Guess what - not allowed, health & safety :lol: kids can use the bandsaw but a grown man cannot :eusa-clap:
User avatar
Coolhands
New Shoots
 
Posts: 84
Joined: 03 Apr 2018, 20:39
Location: Edgware, London
Name:

Re: Shed rebuild

Postby RogerS » 25 Sep 2018, 06:57

Coolhands wrote:I work in a school, so in preparation for when I seat my framing on a bed of mortar, I asked the DT technician about me making some simple folding wedges after hours with offcuts. Guess what - not allowed, health & safety :lol: kids can use the bandsaw but a grown man cannot :eusa-clap:


He's just being a jobsworth. He could easily give you a short formal training on using it, fill in the form to say you've had the course etc. But, I guess, he needs to be present (as he would be if the kids were doing it). Beer money ?

In extremis I'm sure someone here could knock you some up.
If opportunity doesn't knock, build a door.
User avatar
RogerS
Petrified Pine
 
Posts: 13290
Joined: 21 Jul 2014, 21:07
Location: Nearly finished. OK OK...call me Pinocchio.
Name:

Re: Shed rebuild

Postby Mike G » 25 Sep 2018, 08:11

Coolhands wrote:......... The sides slope gradually up the front so each stud is a different length; I've got about a 9 cm drop front to rear.......


:shock: Nightmare.

I'd be tempted to rip some 4x2s into long wedge-shapes, spike them together, and place them under the bottom plate. That way all your studs could be the same length.
User avatar
Mike G
Sequoia
 
Posts: 9833
Joined: 30 Jul 2014, 22:36
Location: Suffolk
Name:

Re: Shed rebuild

Postby Coolhands » 25 Sep 2018, 09:32

Yes I used trigonometry to calculate the length of each individual stud as each one varies depending on the distance from the (front or rear) edge! (I used the centre point of each stud as of course ideally the top should be cut with the 1 degree angle but I cut all mine at 90 degree, but now I’m being fussy). Hence my questions earlier about a ‘flat roof’!
User avatar
Coolhands
New Shoots
 
Posts: 84
Joined: 03 Apr 2018, 20:39
Location: Edgware, London
Name:

Re: Shed rebuild

Postby Coolhands » 06 Oct 2018, 12:40

Day of action! Of course peeing down now but just about managed to get it all up just as rain arrived with the help of my dad (mortar duty) and brother (lifting & placement duty) who came over. Have had to run round trying to protect the mortar with excess DPM and plastic to stop it washing away. Hope it stays ok, the rain is getting heavy but nothing I can do.

Over the last couple of weeks I'd made the wall sections after work in evenings. Each piece had to be manageable in terms of size and weight as making on my own. Each side wall 2 pieces, 3 for the back, and 1 for each side of the front doorway, so 9 main sections overall.

Double header plate for front door and window are constructed but left out until afterwards for weight reasons.

IMG_2478.JPG
(396.29 KiB)


IMG_2477.JPG
(374.01 KiB)


EB6B576F-DD1A-4134-B2A3-B7966E8BBD29.jpeg
(376.37 KiB)
Last edited by Coolhands on 06 Oct 2018, 19:42, edited 4 times in total.
User avatar
Coolhands
New Shoots
 
Posts: 84
Joined: 03 Apr 2018, 20:39
Location: Edgware, London
Name:

Re: Shed rebuild

Postby Coolhands » 06 Oct 2018, 14:42

34B8D059-1545-486E-AB6B-12B2A380653A.jpeg
(372.46 KiB)


B76807C6-4465-44F1-8B6D-646F30BA353D.jpeg
(518.44 KiB)


4AECE245-B76A-460F-8A34-611EC484087E.jpeg
(353.49 KiB)


only issue is the top plate extending above the door which has bent and twisted since I made it and now doesn't meet. I have bought more wood this afternoon and will replace with straight piece tomorrow. The front and rear wall then get another head plate (so will have 2 in total) as my joists won't be sitting above the uprights.
Last edited by Coolhands on 06 Oct 2018, 19:45, edited 2 times in total.
User avatar
Coolhands
New Shoots
 
Posts: 84
Joined: 03 Apr 2018, 20:39
Location: Edgware, London
Name:

Re: Shed rebuild

Postby Malc2098 » 06 Oct 2018, 18:08

Oh dear, bail out or syphon out time.
Malcolm
User avatar
Malc2098
Sequoia
 
Posts: 7207
Joined: 03 Jul 2016, 11:10
Location: Tiverton
Name: Malcolm

Re: Shed rebuild

Postby RogerS » 06 Oct 2018, 18:24

Malc2098 wrote:Oh dear, bail out or syphon out time.


He can sweep it out of the door, I think
If opportunity doesn't knock, build a door.
User avatar
RogerS
Petrified Pine
 
Posts: 13290
Joined: 21 Jul 2014, 21:07
Location: Nearly finished. OK OK...call me Pinocchio.
Name:

Re: Shed rebuild

Postby Coolhands » 06 Oct 2018, 19:32

you're not wrong! Rain now stopped, my protection looks like it worked and the mortar has not been washed out

IMG_2499.JPG
(330.6 KiB)
User avatar
Coolhands
New Shoots
 
Posts: 84
Joined: 03 Apr 2018, 20:39
Location: Edgware, London
Name:

Re: Shed rebuild

Postby Malc2098 » 06 Oct 2018, 20:35

Result! Now lets get rid of the water!
Malcolm
User avatar
Malc2098
Sequoia
 
Posts: 7207
Joined: 03 Jul 2016, 11:10
Location: Tiverton
Name: Malcolm

Re: Shed rebuild

Postby Coolhands » 12 Oct 2018, 10:22

67678AF0-987C-47BC-A4DC-E0E5B4EC5EBF.jpeg
(604.73 KiB)


I will taking the header plates off all round and chopping 6” off all uprights then putting back together as it’s too high and imposing. Then roof joists can go on. A load more work but in the end I've decided to do it. I've bought a reciprocating saw to chop them all down :)

Corners - 3 views of the same corner:

1a.png
(2.12 MiB)


2a.png
(2.34 MiB)


3a.png
(2.59 MiB)
User avatar
Coolhands
New Shoots
 
Posts: 84
Joined: 03 Apr 2018, 20:39
Location: Edgware, London
Name:

PreviousNext

Return to Workshop Builds

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 6 guests