• Hi all and welcome to TheWoodHaven2 brought into the 21st Century, kicking and screaming! We all have Alasdair to thank for the vast bulk of the heavy lifting to get us here, no more so than me because he's taken away a huge burden of responsibility from my shoulders and brought us to this new shiny home, with all your previous content (hopefully) still intact! Please peruse and feed back. There is still plenty to do, like changing the colour scheme, adding the banner graphic, tweaking the odd setting here and there so I have added a new thread in the 'Technical Issues, Bugs and Feature Requests' forum for you to add any issues you find, any missing settings or just anything you'd like to see added/removed from the feature set that Xenforo offers. We will get to everything over the coming weeks so please be patient, but add anything at all to the thread I mention above and we promise to get to them over the next few days/weeks/months. In the meantime, please enjoy!

Mike's ext'n & renovation (Flint wall finished)

I might be wrong but I think professional joiners would be satisfied what that level of “not perfect”.
Which is not meant to be casting doubt on your level of skill just the difficulty that us amateurs have of knowing when to stop.
 
I'd love to know how pro joiners would tackle a window like that. I'm absolutely certain it wouldn't be the way I did it, although a decent morticer with accurate fencing etc would have taken a lot of the mental strain out of setting the joints up. I suspect the mullion wouldn't have been tenoned into the top two members, but might have been dowelled in or something. And the bottom outside corners.....if I'd have just cut the frame members off flush with the cill and screwed through the top, the job would have been finished days and days ago.
 
I'd love to know how pro joiners would tackle a window like that. I'm absolutely certain it wouldn't be the way I did it, although a decent morticer with accurate fencing etc would have taken a lot of the mental strain out of setting the joints up. I suspect the mullion wouldn't have been tenoned into the top two members, but might have been dowelled in or something. And the bottom outside corners.....if I'd have just cut the frame members off flush with the cill and screwed through the top, the job would have been finished days and days ago.
The quickest way possible while achieving strength and weatherproofing is the answer Mike so yes machinery, dowels or dominos. hand cutting those joints would make the cost prohibitive I'd expect.

Great WIP following and enjoying as usual. I've done the same as you with the overhead clamps btw, resulting in a nasty bloody gash, only did it once. :oops:
 
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It's unrealistic really to compare bespoke amateur joinery with a production facility. Precision jigs, accurate machinery, tenoning systems / dominos, industrial glues, and probably the use of resin impregnated materials. I think your work is totally fine - carefully thought through and executed with traditional tools and little expense. It's just different routes to a satisfactory solution. Wood is fickle anyway, as it shifts around in the weather.
 
I'd love to know how pro joiners would tackle a window like that. I'm absolutely certain it wouldn't be the way I did it, although a decent morticer with accurate fencing etc would have taken a lot of the mental strain out of setting the joints up. I suspect the mullion wouldn't have been tenoned into the top two members, but might have been dowelled in or something. And the bottom outside corners.....if I'd have just cut the frame members off flush with the cill and screwed through the top, the job would have been finished days and days ago.
40 years as a professional joiner and I don’t think I would have done it any other way (including the 'fix'). The old joiner who was my dad’s tradesman (and was fast and loose with a gnarly walking stick to the back of your head if he thought you weren't listening) told me the difference between a good and bad joiner wasn't accuracy in cutting joints as with a bit of practice and patience any fool could cut wood but what made the good joiners were how they dealt with the mistakes they made. Because we all make mistakes however, not all of us can rectify the mistakes to a decent level without starting again.


I have worked with so called bench joiners who couldn't join their hands together even if you drew them a diagram.

The skill shown here is far more than a lot of joiners possess and the workflow is incredible.
 
That is one stout window and a good fix. Much nicer than scarfing in a patch. It always surprises me how much adding even one angle here or there complicates the job tremendously.
 
That is one stout window and a good fix. Much nicer than scarfing in a patch. It always surprises me how much adding even one angle here or there complicates the job tremendously.
Oh yes. Add in an upstand to take BOTH edges out of the equation, and life suddenly gets very interesting.
 
Super job Mike, and a good get out, I also have slips of material the exact width of a tenon less? or is it plus a bandsaw kerf? to make cutting the tenons on the bs easy and reliable, is it a thing? I remember I was quite pleased with myself when I came up with it. Obviously a few different slips to match the Morticer cutters.
Ian
 
Super job Mike, and a good get out, I also have slips of material the exact width of a tenon less? or is it plus a bandsaw kerf? to make cutting the tenons on the bs easy and reliable, is it a thing? I remember I was quite pleased with myself when I came up with it. Obviously a few different slips to match the Morticer cutters.
Ian
I planed a couple of bits up to suit, and threw them away afterwards. I'm not expecting to have to do anything quite like that again.......but if I do I'll just plane up another packer. And yes.....the kerf. It was working that out that made the joint work.
 
.....The skill shown here is far more than a lot of joiners possess and the workflow is incredible.
I can't tell you how much comments like yours and Dans mean to me, coming from pros. Thank you sincerely.
 
I've got quite a busy programme of work in front of me on the house this spring and summer, and the major job is to do the external works around the sunroom. This includes retaining walls, patio, ramp, and some edged planting areas. Let's have a look at what it looks like now.

Looking south, and moving southwards in order:

5hJiyLF.jpg


ILzlYF2.jpg


5n8lvuL.jpg


Looking north:

Sv823zN.jpg


Looking west, towards the front of the property:

dPUEcXJ.jpg


8Ypw4GT.jpg


Looking north east:

hWRi6dG.jpg


The first job is to put an Acco drain outside the back doorstep, to enable a flush threshold to be used. When I did the main drainage works 6 or 8 years ago, I left a "Y" to connect the surface water from the sunroom and it's roof into the rest of the sytem. I marked it with a piece of wood, and back filled. So, I removed the dangerous temporary steps, and dug down the piece of wood to find the joint and set myself a depth:

yQrVS3G.jpg


I'd wrapped it in a plastic bag to keep the muck out:

3U8S4AS.jpg


YFU033F.jpg


I made the necessary joints:

Yl4oJGa.jpg


(and yes, WD40 is a great lubricant for putting plastic drainage together). It falls quite steeply, but it's only taking surface water, not solids, so that doesn't matter.

Nl3jBGv.jpg


Then backfilled with shingle:

VvxApeq.jpg


To avoid a little strip of brick showing outside my aluiminium level access threshold, I took an off-cut and marked where the outer edge would come:

2AI5JG0.jpg


I'd have loved to have just taken an angle grinder to it, but the room is in use, so filling it with dust wouldn't be a good idea. I sacrificed an old hardpoint saw instead:

bUhjgo9.jpg


And then chopped off the shoulder of the bricks with a cold chisel and lump hammer:

ZbkkjUw.jpg


I then cast up a concrete base for the Acco drain:

tkNc4hP.jpg


7oFxwyx.jpg


After that went off overnight, I mixed up a strong mortar and carefully bedded the gully into place:

lkZe5gj.jpg


VTUfP5u.jpg


I then spent a few hours digging away all the loose stuff and vegetation, spreading some hardcore, marking out levels, and then casting a sub-base of concrete:

pHwYzvO.jpg


Note the gully by the corner of the steps, and the adjacent level mark (which marks the top of the paving, not the concrete sub-base level:

fOT1o9h.jpg


There's another gully on the other side of the steps:

xX1dcwt.jpg


The level at the threshold is about 30mm above the level at the front of the steps, falling some 1 in 35 away from the house. Here's the Acco and adjacent level mark:

WAMWfG3.jpg


Here's a minor cock-up from the time I did the screed in the sunroom. I forgot to run this 'phone line (in a hose as a duct) in and under the floor. It runs out to the workshop so that I can have a 'phone out there. There's a chance of an alternative route, so I laid it out under the walkway/ patio area:

thpGUiT.jpg


The concreting was held up by the explosion of my wheelbarrow tyre whilst the barrow was empty and un-used. It scared the life out of my dog, who was napping nearby, and it flung rubber 2 or 3 metres. I had to fix two puntures in the other barrow's tube before resuming. Anyway, it got done, and I just had time to begin the most complex part of this job: laying out the line of the curved brick retaining without having access to the centre point of the arc. I laid out a centre line the length of the garden, and put a peg on it in a random but useful location. This is the pivot point of the formwork/ pattern I'll make:

RYhpIlj.jpg


2UsUIDN.jpg


The two angled strings are the datum lines, mirrored about the centre line, so that I can take a pattern on one side, then flip it over, line it up with the other string, and use it to set out the wall on the other side.
 
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I've got quite a busy programme of work in front of me on the house this spring and summer, and the major job is to do the external works around the sunroom. This includes retaining walls, patio, ramp, and some edged planting areas. Let's have a look at what it looks like now.

Looking south, and moving southwards in order:

5hJiyLF.jpg


ILzlYF2.jpg


5n8lvuL.jpg


Looking north:

Sv823zN.jpg


Looking west, towards the front of the property:

dPUEcXJ.jpg


8Ypw4GT.jpg


Looking north east:

hWRi6dG.jpg


The first job is to put an Acco drain outside the back doorstep, to enable a flush threshold to be used. When I did the main drainage works 6 or 8 years ago, I left a "Y" to connect the surface water from the sunroom and it's roof into the rest of the sytem. I marked it with a piece of wood, and back filled. So, I removed the dangerous temporary steps, and dug down the piece of wood to find the joint and set myself a depth:

yQrVS3G.jpg


I'd wrapped it in a plastic bag to keep the muck out:

3U8S4AS.jpg


YFU033F.jpg


I made the necessary joints:

Yl4oJGa.jpg


(and yes, WD40 is a great lubricant for putting plastic drainage together). It falls quite steeply, but it's only taking surface water, not solids, so that doesn't matter.

Nl3jBGv.jpg


Then backfilled with shingle:

VvxApeq.jpg


To avoid a little strip of brick showing outside my aluiminium level access threshold, I took an off-cut and marked where the outer edge would come:

2AI5JG0.jpg


I'd have loved to have just taken an angle grinder to it, but the room is in use, so filling it with dust wouldn't be a good idea. I sacrificed an old hardpoint saw instead:

bUhjgo9.jpg


And then chopped off the shoulder of the bricks with a cold chisel and lump hammer:

ZbkkjUw.jpg


I then cast up a concrete base for the Acco drain:

tkNc4hP.jpg


7oFxwyx.jpg


After that went off overnight, I mixed up a strong mortar and carefully bedded the gully into place:

lkZe5gj.jpg


VTUfP5u.jpg


I then spent a few hours digging away all the loose stuff and vegetation, spreading some hardcore, marking out levels, and then casting a sub-base of concrete:

pHwYzvO.jpg


Note the gully by the corner of the steps, and the adjacent level mark (which marks the top of the paving, not the concrete sub-base level:

fOT1o9h.jpg


There's another gully on the other side of the steps:

xX1dcwt.jpg


The level at the threshold is about 30mm above the level at the front of the steps, falling some 1 in 35 away from the house. Here's the Acco and adjacent level mark:

WAMWfG3.jpg


Here's a minor cock-up from the time I did the screed in the sunroom. I forgot to run this 'phone line (in a hose as a duct) in and under the floor. It runs out to the workshop so that I can have a 'phone out there. There's a chance of an alternative route, so I laid it out under the walkway/ patio area:

thpGUiT.jpg


The concreting was held up by the explosion of my wheelbarrow tyre whilst the barrow was empty and un-used. It scared the life out of my dog, who was napping nearby, and it flung rubber 2 or 3 metres. I had to fix two puntures in the other barrow's tube before resuming. Anyway, it got done, and I just had time to begin the most complex part of this job: laying out the line of the curved brick retaining without having access to the centre point of the arc. I laid out a centre line the length of the garden, and put a peg on it in a random but useful location. This is the pivot point of the formwork/ pattern I'll make:

RYhpIlj.jpg


2UsUIDN.jpg


The two angled strings are the datum lines, mirrored about the centre line, so that I can take a pattern on one side, then flip it over, line it up with the other string, and use it to set out the wall on the other side.
Great job with your garden and your level of hard landscaping and design is exceptional. Bet you will be glad seeing it all tie in. Watching with interest.
 
Thanks Duke. There was nothing here at all when we bought it, so we're pretty pleased with the garden. This little area I've just started dealing with is the last part of the property that's still a building site. I'm hoping to tick it off this summer.
 
Mike....very nice lawn. And what will be the finished walkway, stone, or tile?
 
Indian sandstone.

That lawn is deceptive. It's actually rough as old boots. It was 4 feet tall when we bought the place, and it's just rough meadow grasses.
 
Hey Mike, what are you growing in your greenhouse? I have nothing in mine but returning home Sunday then I will get the tomatoes in. In the first photo what is the plant trailing over your brick retaining wall?
 
I am not showing any of this to my wife. But I now have lots of ideas for the landscape around my shed.
 
Hey Mike, what are you growing in your greenhouse? I have nothing in mine but returning home Sunday then I will get the tomatoes in. In the first photo what is the plant trailing over your brick retaining wall?
The greenhouse is definitely my wife's territory rather than mine, but I do have a clue what's growing in there. Firstly, we have 26 tomato plants, which is at least 10 more than we need. We have cucumbers, peppers (capsicum), chili, ginger, melons and one or two other things I can't remember at the moment, plus some hydrangeas..........and dozens of seed trays full of stuff for planting out. It's just had a major clear-out as a whole lot of stuff in trays and pots has now been planted out in the garden, or moved to the cold frames. My pride and joy, though, is a grape vine, which is planted outside and trained in through a hole in the wall, and this year, it's 4th year, it is producing scores of bunches of a white seedless grape. I'll maybe grab some photos later of that and the veggie patch if I remember.

Trailing over the wall in a couple of places is a variagated ivy. The main feature of the wall, though, is the fleabane, which is also known as Mexican daisy, which is just now starting to spring into life. In a few weeks time it will fill the entirety of the bed and hide the top of the wall.
 
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Mike, I'm a bit puzzled by the threshold into the sunroom. It has a brick edge, with the faces chopped off and then about 5-6cm by the look of it of mortar to reach the drainage gully. Given the stone floor in that room, was it not possible whip the bricks out and cut some slabs to run from the edge of the mat well to the gully to achieve a more cohesive threshold? It seems an odd design for you. Not criticising, just wondering.
 
I've just realised. You probably think my sunroom is a greenhouse. Go back to page 100 or before, and follow the progress of the sunroom. This is my greenhouse, from 5 or 6 years ago when I built it:

qOXpGL0.jpg
I followed your greenhouse build . I'm getting long in the tooth but not ready for the pasture. Lol.
 
Mike, I'm a bit puzzled by the threshold into the sunroom. It has a brick edge, with the faces chopped off and then about 5-6cm by the look of it of mortar to reach the drainage gully. Given the stone floor in that room, was it not possible whip the bricks out and cut some slabs to run from the edge of the mat well to the gully to achieve a more cohesive threshold? It seems an odd design for you. Not criticising, just wondering.
I don't think there's a lot to be gained by doing that. The stone would only be 6 inches wide, with 4" of it hidden under the aluminium threshold strip. The way I've done it you'll see mat, threshold strip, mortar, drain, mortar, stone, working from inside to out.

The other thing mortar between the threshold strip and the drain allows me to do is slope the drain slightly. There is no fall built in to the drainage channel, so I needed to go from a level threshold to a sloping drain in a matter of 30 odd mm, and that would difficult using stone.
 
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This morning I laid a few slabs on yesterday's concrete. They're fully bedded on mortar (not dot and dab), because I don't like giving ants a place to hide. The stone is second hand, and from 2 different sources, but once cleaned it will all look the same. It's laid but not pointed:

8wbzdbb.jpg


opmVY8c.jpg


This is how the threshold detail works:

b7sZYdQ.jpg


Next, I made a pattern on the existing side of the wall (I guess boat-builders would call this spiling):

Adb6nP0.jpg


I had to place additional pins because I don't have long enough peices to reach the centre-point:

s5wohuX.jpg


Hkmmmn7.jpg


pIPocnC.jpg


I then dragged it out, flipped it over, and dragged it to its new location as a mirror image of where it started:

h053DYO.jpg


Oh look, some clown went and built a roof in the way:

UYGKg1O.jpg


The end of the battens obviously represent the face of the brickwork. Set back at measured distances are the back of the foundation, and the back of the planting border. I marked these in the lawn:

xFMiwCZ.jpg


With the pattern in place, I could then start work on the face brickwork of the retaining wall. It was very easy to drop a level against the end of the battens and check my line:

VSK6yPg.jpg


This wall is going to step up as the paving ramps up to garden level, and extend fairly close to the location of one of my other forthcoming projects: the dividing wall between the car parking area and the garden. I built as far as I could on the foundation I poured a year or three back:

KuM17wj.jpg


3XuCqX2.jpg


5yHLTo5.jpg


The lines of digging are fairly easy to see now. I've moved the pattern out of place, as I have a series of stepped foundations to dig and pour, and I'll then move it back into position to finish the brickwork:

18yfbvu.jpg
 
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At me previous house we did the threshold exactly the same. The bottom plate was part of the aluminium door frame for the bifold but otherwise the same. We decided to lay the accu channel level as the patio fell away from it and was therefore rarely likely to actually get anything significant in in except if we had some wind driven rain. I remember seeing it wet inside only a handful of times in about 10 years

Mark
 
I think you're right in suggesting it's not going to get much water in the Acco channel, but driving rain against the door now at least has somewhere to go rather than being blown in under the door.
 
Hi Mike
One wheelbarrow is never enough, you need two at least, I have three. :sneaky: Failing that a couple of spare wheels.

Is that retaining brick wall going to stay 1/2 brick thick or will you be reinforcing or backfilling with rubble? It looks as if finished heigh is possibly at least 600mm in which case I would have been building a full brick thick.
 
It's quite a build up, with concrete backfill to 225 from the top, then blockwork above that. It is actually only 4 courses plus the coping above the paving level, or a little over 400mm high, so believe it or not, a half brick thickness would in theory work alone. Not that I'd ever risk it.
 
It's quite a build up, with concrete backfill to 225 from the top, then blockwork above that. It is actually only 4 courses plus the coping above the paving level, or a little over 400mm high, so believe it or not, a half brick thickness would in theory work alone. Not that I'd ever risk it.
Makes sense Mike. I wouldn't risk theory either. It's not much comfort if it ends up failing and I've fixed a couple for other people.

looking good, I'm just catching up a bit as wifi coverage has been patchy in the highlands.
 
One wheelbarrow is never enough, you need two at least, I have three. :sneaky: Failing that a couple of spare wheels.

My spare barrow had a flat tyre, with two puntures. It was already in the utility awaiting repair.....which the explosion hurried along. I've got two new tyres and three new tubes arriving today.
 
Yes, I've seen that stuff Jim. I'm going to wet point mine with a strong cement mortar. The biggest cause of failure in patios, in my experience, is where they were dry pointed (ie a dry dust of sand & cement is brushed into the gaps). I've had reasonable success with wet pointing, although it is a more difficult and slow process.
 
Great product, use it on all my interlock projects.
 
Yes, I've seen that stuff Jim. I'm going to wet point mine with a strong cement mortar. The biggest cause of failure in patios, in my experience, is where they were dry pointed (ie a dry dust of sand & cement is brushed into the gaps). I've had reasonable success with wet pointing, although it is a more difficult and slow process.
Good point Mike, I always wet point when the stone is mortared down. I will add a bonding additive . I like my mix when squeezed in hand will stay clumped . You can really pack a joint this way. Too wet a mix is a nightmare to work with.

How do you do your mix?
 
I think pointing on any paving is laborious, as it is best to avoid getting much on the stone and allowing it to go off as the clean up afterwards is a nightmare. I had "help" from a bricklayer friend doing the large black slabs in our kitchen. He was much faster than me but made a lot more mess and it was a lot of work cleaning up afterwards. The resin stuff looks interesting.
 
I think pointing on any paving is laborious, as it is best to avoid getting much on the stone and allowing it to go off as the clean up afterwards is a nightmare. I had "help" from a bricklayer friend doing the large black slabs in our kitchen. He was much faster than me but made a lot more mess and it was a lot of work cleaning up afterwards. The resin stuff looks interesting.
With the resin stuff you sweep it into the joints with jointing interlock concrete paving stone. You must get all the dust off the pavers. Then i will use a fine water mist to set the dust. One pass making sure not to create run off. Then a second pass when surface is dry.
 
Good point Mike, I always wet point when the stone is mortared down. I will add a bonding additive . I like my mix when squeezed in hand will stay clumped . You can really pack a joint this way. Too wet a mix is a nightmare to work with.

How do you do your mix?
Exactly as you describe. I try to form a sausage-shape of the mortar and drop that as neatly as I can into the joint, and then smooth it down with a pointing tool. If it gets on the surface of the stone I leave it to dry a bit before sweeping it up and sponging off. If you try to clean up too soon it just smears and makes an awful mess.
 
I also find that the packing with pointing tool prevents water getting into the joint . If you live in an area with a lot of freeze thaw cycles your joints will remain in place and not crack and loosen out.
 
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