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Been considering building a new bench

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Been considering building a new bench

Postby Cabinetman » 27 Jul 2021, 03:51

Now whilst I don’t need a new bench, mine have always been long, 2 feet deep 3” Beech and fastened to the wall, but recently talk of people building their own benches has got me got me thinking it would be fun to make a new one, freestanding this time - without a well, but with a planing stick, I have a couple of assembly tables and find I work on those nearly as much as my bench as they have a larger flat surface, not into MFT style.
And so I have been doing a little research and the question I want to ask is.
With the reliability and ease of use of a quick release Record vice, why would you want - and what are the advantages of, a wooden thread leg vice. The sliding deadman I understand and would like one next time. Ian
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Re: Been considering building a new bench

Postby sunnybob » 27 Jul 2021, 05:31

The plus side of the large record vices is the quick release mechanism, which saves you ages turning the handle. :eusa-clap:
The negative side of the record vice is the quick release mechanism, which "can" sometimes slip under extra pressure and let your work come crashing down. :eusa-pray:
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Re: Been considering building a new bench

Postby Steve Maskery » 27 Jul 2021, 08:38

Well, I've never had a leg vice, so my opinion is purely theoretical, but if you mount it at an angle, as Chris Schwartz does, you can get a lot of capacity withought the screw getting in the way.
The downside is that you have to keep adjusting the spacer peg at the bottom, which might well be a hands-and-knees job, unless you have deep pockets and spring for a Croix-de-St-Pierre or the Benchcrafted thingy.

A few years ago I bought a pair of holdfasts. They are now my go-to method of holding stock, I use my vices a lot less than I used to.

I recommend you buy two books, Landis and Schwartz. They are both packed with useful info, and Schwartz is a very entertaining writer.

I built a new bench a year ot two back. I love it.

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Re: Been considering building a new bench

Postby Blackswanwood » 27 Jul 2021, 10:28

One of Schwarz's books is available as a free pdf

https://blog.lostartpress.com/2020/07/0 ... bench-pdf/
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Re: Been considering building a new bench

Postby Cabinetman » 27 Jul 2021, 13:37

Steve Maskery wrote:Well, I've never had a leg vice, so my opinion is purely theoretical, but if you mount it at an angle, as Chris Schwartz does, you can get a lot of capacity withought the screw getting in the way.
The downside is that you have to keep adjusting the spacer peg at the bottom, which might well be a hands-and-knees job, unless you have deep pockets and spring for a Croix-de-St-Pierre or the Benchcrafted thingy.

A few years ago I bought a pair of holdfasts. They are now my go-to method of holding stock, I use my vices a lot less than I used to.

I recommend you buy two books, Landis and Schwartz. They are both packed with useful info, and Schwartz is a very entertaining writer.

I built a new bench a year ot two back. I love it.


Thanks Steve, I will have a look at those books and I had already seen your video thank you. Quite agree about the holdfasts I brought two Gramercy ones back from the States with me last time and they are wonderful, use them on the apron and top all the time.
Never owned a freestanding bench does yours move about at all in use? Just watched your video again and obviously no it doesn’t move! I was coming to the idea of an apron on one side only and so thanks for that I can see it works well, you really can cramp things anywhere and everywhere on your bench can’t you, have you ever missed or thought about having a vice on both sides? Ian
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Re: Been considering building a new bench

Postby Mike G » 27 Jul 2021, 13:50

The rest of the world is jealous of our wonderful cast iron vices. There isn't a single good reason to contemplate changing away from one, I reckon. Leg vices, in my experience, are OK, but a bit of a fiddle, slow, and a bit sloppy. Yes, you can make them work, but unless you do something very unusual I can't really see any advantages to outweight those disadvantages.
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Re: Been considering building a new bench

Postby AndyT » 27 Jul 2021, 14:27

Just for the sake of balance, and as the user of a lightweight bench that's screwed to the floor, I think it's the people whose benches aren't fixed down that are missing out.

I cringe whenever I see a video of a bench that's bouncing around to the rhythm of the saw or the chisel.

Mine has a top glued up from cheap 3x2 studding, but it's fixed down so it's rock solid. The obvious advantage is that I didn't need to spend 100s or more on thick, wet hardwood.

And my second hand Record 52 1/2 is so good and quick. It's already 80 years old but it'll see me out.

I've read and watched a lot about wooden screw vices and I have the means to make one, but there's just no point.

An iron vice and a pair of holdfasts really do 99% of the jobs.
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Re: Been considering building a new bench

Postby Raymedullary » 27 Jul 2021, 14:44

I have made all kinds of wooden vice as a result of setting up workshops in African schools to demonstrate a more self reliant environment, everything works once you get used to it's quirks. The type of wooden vice you describe is nice if you desire a scandavanian look otherwise I would just get yourself a 52 1/2 !
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Re: Been considering building a new bench

Postby Steve Maskery » 27 Jul 2021, 14:57

Cabinetman wrote: have you ever missed or thought about having a vice on both sides?


No, I don't see what advantage it would give me.

If you do use any of the ideas from my bench, watch the follow-up vid first! :)

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Re: Been considering building a new bench

Postby Woodbloke » 27 Jul 2021, 18:07

Mike G wrote:The rest of the world is jealous of our wonderful cast iron vices. There isn't a single good reason to contemplate changing away from one, I reckon. Leg vices, in my experience, are OK, but a bit of a fiddle, slow, and a bit sloppy. Yes, you can make them work, but unless you do something very unusual I can't really see any advantages to outweight those disadvantages.

I agree Mike; I’ve used a Record 52.5 for at least 40 years now and it’s never let me down, so I see no reason to change it. As Steve M has mentioned ‘the Schwarz’ is a very entertaining writer and I particularly remember his little missive on benches, where he said that it really doesn’t matter how you build them as long as they have mass and lots of it. When a bench gets to about 150Kg (I think that’s the figure he quoted in the ATC) it ain’t going nowhere regardless of what you do to it. That figure sounds a lot, but by the time you factor in a heavy beech frame and a really thick (75 or 100mm solid top, all the way across), 150Kg+ is quite easy to achieve - Rob
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Re: Been considering building a new bench

Postby Cabinetman » 27 Jul 2021, 18:25

Thank you gentlemen all of you, that seems very conclusive to me and suits me down to the ground as I’m very happy with my 52 1/2.
I’m halfway through the Schwartz book and most entertaining I must say..
Obviously if and as and when I build my new bench I will be fully entertaining you with lots of pictures. Cheers Ian
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Re: Been considering building a new bench

Postby TomTrees » 28 Jul 2021, 18:26

Hello Cabinetman
Since you've got a well equipped workshop already, including benches.

Putting fun aside, what do you wish to achieve...
Could it be another bench for space/different projects?

Is there anything which the wall mounted benches can't do?...
The only thing I can think of is for heavy and large projects which you can approach from both sides, as likely easier with an island bench.

You have got assembly tables also, so sounds like you've got a on everything you need.
One could think of the show piece aspect, it would make a nice addition to your page, business card or for ads.

I'd personally be looking for the trickiest things you can remember doing, and focusing on seeing if that job can be made easier, should you not have figured out a better way to do that job half way through it already :lol:

Do you have enough infeed/outfeeds, I made a sharpening station to suit, in addition to the bench for that need.

The workbench book is a nice read if you can find it,
there's things like a double tail vice, and likely the most unusual benches you might find.
There's some good ideas on it too, not just super specific crafts.

There's a good "the workbench" section on the Auzzie woodwork forum too, worth a look.

If you like Schwarz talk about benches, then you might enjoy this.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8fY5szcZEDo

For the really really really obsessed,
there's a thread called "workbench smackdown" aswell as a part 2 on a lumberjocks page,
but it would literally take about 3 or 4 hours to get through part 1.
Hundreds of benches, you really do need a pen and paper and fast internet to make use of it
To be honest its mostly Roubo types, but in differing timbers.


Depending on your opinion, you might be better off not spending a full week to get through these.
especially the workbench smackdown thread.

Curious to see what you think might be the most difficult operation to do with your setup,
I suspect it's catered towards a good few paying jobs, which crop up often.

All the best
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Re: Been considering building a new bench

Postby thetyreman » 28 Jul 2021, 20:13

also happy with my record no 52 1/2 vice, but have considered getting a no53E which is the ultimate vice in many ways, that extra reach can be handy.
'Knowing is not enough, we must apply. Willing is not enough, we must do' Johann Wolfgang von Goethe
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Re: Been considering building a new bench

Postby Cabinetman » 28 Jul 2021, 20:31

Hi Tom, you’ve been putting some thought into this! I just had a hankering for a freestanding really solid bench, which as you say I can walk around. I am semi retired now and like a lot of others I am rediscovering an interest in hand tool work, my present benches form an L shape in a corner of my workshop one of my benches is 12 feet long and the other 11, just happened to be the length of the planks, installed when my son worked with me, he since has gone off to earn some proper money and start a family (with my blessing). The work part of both benches is a piece of Beech 13 inches across x 3 1/2 inches thick built onto a beach frame with aprons, the whole lot is then fastened to the walls, which has worked well for the past 10 years.
13 inches with a matching 3 inch wide piece at the back which can be moved about is ok but it has its limitations hence I do quite a bit of work on my assembly tables, over time your thoughts and perceptions change and hence I have a hankering for a wide solid top, almost definitely with a planing stick up the middle. You are right in some ways about a showpiece bench, but it won’t be for advertising purposes this is a vanity project just for myself I suppose – years of making things for other people and now it’s my turn!

You asked about difficult work, if you type in the word Behomoth at the top, a huge desk I made will come up, but I don’t think that would’ve been any easier on any sort of bench haha.

Thanks for the links, funnily enough I am actually in a position where I have a week with nothing to do and time to spend, - quite useful thank you. Back to daydreaming! Do I rip those benches out to remake the tops into my new one? Time will tell, I have finished reading Chris Schwartz's book and as so often these things are best left to furculate in your brain without thinking too much about them for a while. Cheers Ian
Last edited by Cabinetman on 28 Jul 2021, 20:42, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Been considering building a new bench

Postby Cabinetman » 28 Jul 2021, 20:34

thetyreman wrote:also happy with my record no 52 1/2 vice, but have considered getting a no53E which is the ultimate vice in many ways, that extra reach can be handy.

Actually I am doubly blessed as I have 52 and a 53 both quick release, I’m considering putting one on either side!
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