It is currently 29 Mar 2024, 00:55

Toxic timber

This forum is for any general questions, queries or plain old chinwaggery on Woody stuff in general.

Toxic timber

Postby Mike Jordan » 25 Jun 2022, 10:57

I’ve just been viewing a site on which large numbers of wooden items are advertised as having been made from recycled pallet wood. I am aware that toxic treatments on pallets are not supposed to be allowed here or in European countries, but by their very nature these things must travel round the world.
It seems logical to me that those that are not reused as pallets must be uneconomic to return to country of origin and then available as “free wood”and are most likely not compliant with regulations we might follow.
I am wondering if the operators of the sites advertising these products are ensuring that the makers are aware of the risks involved and if anybody involved carries product liability cover.
I saw TV shots of large bonfires awaiting lighting to mark the recent jubilee and observed many blue painted pallets included, so it seems that not everyone is aware of the rules.
I try to buy nothing from China.
Mike Jordan
Sapling
 
Posts: 353
Joined: 10 Mar 2017, 17:06
Location: Littleover Derby.
Name: Mike Jordan

Re: Toxic timber

Postby Mike Jordan » 28 Jun 2022, 19:48

I fear that the lack of any response bears out my conviction that those who make use of this material prefer to keep up the pretence that there is no hazard either from the toxins used to make the timer proof against pests,or any possible contamination from chemical or biological contamination from the materials carried on the pallets. While channel hopping a couple of evenings ago I saw Charlie Dimmock on a garden rescue type programme. What were they working on - an outside bar made from pallet wood. I heard no mention of any hazard and how to avoid it.
Some of the timbers we use are known to be toxic or irritant and sensible woodworkers protect themselves from the dust. I don’t believe that this material should be allowed to fall into the hands of anyone unless it can be proved to be identified and known to be safe.
I try to buy nothing from China.
Mike Jordan
Sapling
 
Posts: 353
Joined: 10 Mar 2017, 17:06
Location: Littleover Derby.
Name: Mike Jordan

Re: Toxic timber

Postby AJB Temple » 28 Jun 2022, 20:23

Mike, I think it more likely that the experienced woodworkers here are in fact already well aware.

I am presently collecting pallet wood. However, I happen to have a source of guaranteed chemical and toxin free pallet wood, as it is used to package glass and stainless steel equipment for immediate commercial use in the food industry. It is rough sawn but surprisingly good quality. Every pallet has a safety label.

When I look around the industrial estate where her business is, much of which is devoted to food distribution on a large scale, it is evident that pallet knowledge is very much in place. I see a lot of blue dyed pallets in one location, carefully stacked and never mixed. Likewise red pallets, plastic pallets and steel framed pallets. These things are not cheap any more (the high grade ones) and few are incinerated.

Kind regards, Adrian
Don't like: wood, engines, electrickery, decorating, tiling, laying stone, plumbing, gardening or any kind of DIY. Not wild about spiders either.
User avatar
AJB Temple
Sequoia
 
Posts: 5432
Joined: 15 Apr 2019, 09:04
Name:

Re: Toxic timber

Postby John Brown » 28 Jun 2022, 20:51

I, for one, am not conversant with the meaning of markings or colours on pallets, and would welcome an explanation, or a link to such.
So far, my use of pallets has been limited to the construction of composting enclosures in our paddock, and I've not used any blue or red ones, but I would like to know more.
John Brown
Sapling
 
Posts: 267
Joined: 05 Jun 2019, 19:38
Location: Gloucestershire
Name:

Re: Toxic timber

Postby Trevanion » 28 Jun 2022, 20:53

I honestly would've thought the pallet wood craze would have died out by now but it's still going strong surprisingly, much like the silly used scaffold plank craze which has ruined secondhand planer thicknessers up and down the country.

Some pallets are like gas cylinders, you own the gas but the supplier owns the cylinder and you must return it, eventually. The blue and red ones are owned by their respective pallet pooling companies and that's why they are segregated in yards as a big lorry will come around eventually and collect them and take them back to base, the colouring is simply to indicate ownership and as far as I'm aware there's no treatment on them beyond a colour.

I agree that possibly TV programmes should take more responsibility when showing pallet wood projects and the like because of the health concerns of using potentially treated pallets (though I imagine they're quite rare, I've not seen one for a long time). Going back to the gas cylinder example, the exact same happened a few years ago when a guy on TV was cutting Calor gas cylinders to use as lamp shades, both the issue of the bottles being owned by Calor and the fact that cutting them could present a serious risk of explosion if not properly vented, the programme had to issue a statement on the following weeks episode telling people not to replicate it.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2460037/BBC-DIY-programme-shows-renovator-cutting-gas-canister-light-fitting.html
Image
User avatar
Trevanion
Old Oak
 
Posts: 2162
Joined: 27 Apr 2019, 19:04
Location: Pembrokeshire
Name:

Re: Toxic timber

Postby Phil Pascoe » 28 Jun 2022, 21:10

A blacksmith I know burned his hand quite badly cutting a gas cylinder with an angle grinder - he thought he'd drained it, but he hadn't.
Phil Pascoe
Old Oak
 
Posts: 1094
Joined: 21 Jul 2014, 22:55
Location: United Kingdom Cornwall
Name: phil

Re: Toxic timber

Postby Mike Jordan » 28 Jun 2022, 21:50

Thanks Adrian, It’s cheering to hear that the colour system and the relatively high value is helping the situation. It’s the ummarked one trip pallets that seem to offer the “free wood” it looks like rubbish and I’m sure it is. I was horrified to see adverts for items for sale that people might use in the home and even for use in contact with food. YouTube features lots of pallet wood projects together with a few people warning of the risks.
John - Details and pictures of the markings can be found if you Google IPPC.
I try to buy nothing from China.
Mike Jordan
Sapling
 
Posts: 353
Joined: 10 Mar 2017, 17:06
Location: Littleover Derby.
Name: Mike Jordan

Re: Toxic timber

Postby novocaine » 29 Jun 2022, 07:49

Carbon fibre is just corduroy for cars.
novocaine
Old Oak
 
Posts: 2560
Joined: 26 Nov 2020, 10:37
Name: Dave

Re: Toxic timber

Postby Sheffield Tony » 29 Jun 2022, 09:13

I"m not enthusiastic about re-used pallet wood, but I think you can worry too much. The painted ones are returnable, don't use them, they are multi-use, so more probably treated, and ... covered in lurid paint.

The natural coloured, single use pallets are a different story. Usually marked "HT" for heat treated, they don't waste chemicals on them, the owners don't expect them back, and being single use carried what arrived on them, which in our case is usually electrical gear or cables so pretty harmless. Being single use they are also rubbish wood, often with live edges, and so mostly fit for firewood.

It is easy to Google the markings - HT=heat treated, KD=kiln dried, MB=treated with Methyl Bromide.
User avatar
Sheffield Tony
Nordic Pine
 
Posts: 558
Joined: 25 Nov 2020, 21:08
Location: Bedfordshire
Name: Tony Hague

Re: Toxic timber

Postby John Brown » 29 Jun 2022, 09:14

Mike Jordan wrote:Thanks Adrian, It’s cheering to hear that the colour system and the relatively high value is helping the situation. It’s the ummarked one trip pallets that seem to offer the “free wood” it looks like rubbish and I’m sure it is. I was horrified to see adverts for items for sale that people might use in the home and even for use in contact with food. YouTube features lots of pallet wood projects together with a few people warning of the risks.
John - Details and pictures of the markings can be found if you Google IPPC.

Thanks.
John Brown
Sapling
 
Posts: 267
Joined: 05 Jun 2019, 19:38
Location: Gloucestershire
Name:

Re: Toxic timber

Postby Woodbloke » 30 Jun 2022, 07:24

Many years ago I scrounged some top quality teak veneer (and others) from a firm in Dorset (now gone bust) The veneers were imported into the UK on pallets made of the same material; they were never seen by the general populace! :lol: - Rob
I no longer work for Axminster Tools & Machinery.
User avatar
Woodbloke
Sequoia
 
Posts: 5866
Joined: 22 Jul 2014, 10:06
Location: Salisbury, UK
Name:

Re: Toxic timber

Postby Mike Jordan » 30 Jun 2022, 07:54

I can’t see that the marking system is very relevant once the pallet is broken up since the stamps won’t be visible. I’ve just looked on the Etsy site and found planks being sold at £20 per square metre for “cladding walls”
I try to buy nothing from China.
Mike Jordan
Sapling
 
Posts: 353
Joined: 10 Mar 2017, 17:06
Location: Littleover Derby.
Name: Mike Jordan


Return to General Woodworking

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 9 guests