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Dead LED panel driver

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Re: Dead LED panel driver

Postby TrimTheKing » 24 Jan 2021, 19:01

Cheers chaps. That’s what was confusing me, the constant current specified then a range shown...!

I’ll have a look at the links you’ve shared, after I’ve watched the second half of United...
Cheers
Mark
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Re: Dead LED panel driver

Postby 9fingers » 24 Jan 2021, 21:15

TrimTheKing wrote:Cheers chaps. That’s what was confusing me, the constant current specified then a range shown...!

I’ll have a look at the links you’ve shared, after I’ve watched the second half of United...


Think of your panel as a resistor R that varies a bit from panel to panel and a bit with temperature, phase of the moon etc.

The voltage V across the panel with a current I is given by I*R ohms law

The power supplied by the driver will be V*I = I*I*R and depending on the leds in the panel, a certain amount of light will be output.
By using a constant current, the driver can keep its efficiency up even though the panels vary a little bit.
Our eyes with their logarithmic response will hardly notice the variation from panel to panel.

If you have a driver with a higher voltage capability, it makes no difference provided the constant current is the same and the power is still given by I*I*R ie nougth to do with the voltage that the driver could produce with a different size panel with a higher R.

Does that help?

Bob
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Re: Dead LED panel driver

Postby TrimTheKing » 29 Jan 2021, 11:00

9fingers wrote:https://www.qvsdirect.com/lighting-lamps/lamps-accessories/drivers-transformers might have something but website down atm
https://www.tlc-direct.co.uk/Products/LTDR50.html bit pricey but reputable company ime

This lot https://panelhut.co.uk/products/40w-48w ... 9_EALw_wcB
specifically say replacement for your panels.

Bob


Ordered and received one of the bottom ones specified for this panel. Plugged in and seems to be working fine. Will keep you appraised.

Thanks for all the help chaps.
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Re: Dead LED panel driver

Postby 9fingers » 19 Feb 2021, 12:25

I've often been critical about the reliability of LED lighting or explicitly the driving circuitry.

I recently stumbled upon this video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=klaJqofCsu4


The presenter is a bit rambling as is his wont but it seems that Philips have been doing some excellent work to get the reliability of the drivers up and at the same time using many more leds allowing them to be run at much lower power per led thus dropping the heat dissipation in both leds and the driver.
Some of the detailed nuances are possibly only for those of a certain interest in electronics but I'm very impressed with what they have done. If the techniques can be licenced outside of Dubai we might at last see some reliable longlife led lighting at even greater efficiency.

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Re: Dead LED panel driver

Postby novocaine » 19 Feb 2021, 12:39

Oi, Big Clive is a legend, leave him alone. :lol:

lighting technician with a real passion for electronics and an all round nice bloke by all accounts, knows his onions too.

It's a good explanation of solutions to fix the problems. Cheers for posting.

on that note, one of my strip LED lights in the workshop went pop on Tuesday night, need to get it apart and see why it happened although I'm fairly sure it's moisture ingress. joys of chained strips, I took it out, slid the next one along to fill the gap and join with the one before it and was back to working albeit with a dark spot over my shoulder. :D
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Re: Dead LED panel driver

Postby 9fingers » 19 Feb 2021, 13:00

novocaine wrote:Oi, Big Clive is a legend, leave him alone. :lol:

lighting technician with a real passion for electronics and an all round nice bloke by all accounts, knows his onions too.

It's a good explanation of solutions to fix the problems. Cheers for posting.

on that note, one of my strip LED lights in the workshop went pop on Tuesday night, need to get it apart and see why it happened although I'm fairly sure it's moisture ingress. joys of chained strips, I took it out, slid the next one along to fill the gap and join with the one before it and was back to working albeit with a dark spot over my shoulder. :D


Yes I quite like Big Clive's stuff although it can be a bit laboured. I watch and keep saying to myself "FFS get on with it" but keep watching nevertheless :lol:
Not sure why he kept muttering about voltage multipliers in this vid. I'd have thought that the last thing you want to do in a led driver is to increase the voltage other than keeping the same LED topology and just changing the driver for 110v countries.

The only led light I have at the moment is a fluorescent drop-in replacement type bi-pin tube.
I've still got a stash of part used conventional tubes in the loft harvested from a laboratory where I used to work and I got permission to go in the day before demolision of the building and strip out metal clad MK sockets, tubes, conduit and wiring. I possibly have a lifetimes (for me!) supply.

I did have a RGB led strip fail that is part of our xmas decorations and that was caused by soldered joints made by the supplier. A pig to fix as the strip with only pcb type tracks is encapsulated in heavy duty silicone.

Bob
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Re: Dead LED panel driver

Postby Lurker » 19 Feb 2021, 14:00

Can someone recommend a supplier and some led lights from my new workshop please?

I have two 600 x 600 led panels that need transferring from the old shop, but I got those from toolstation and suspect they are not the cheapest place.

I fancy led strip lights as general lighting with the panels strategely placed. But am bewildered as they appear to be relatively pricey vs the panels even at toolstation prices.
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Re: Dead LED panel driver

Postby 9fingers » 19 Feb 2021, 14:24

If you want to go the LED route then expect a degree of failure has to be the message.
Two members here (at least) have found this.

If it were as cut and dried as "buy model ABC from supplier DEF" then it would be obvious. If there is a hint from the video I posted, there is a manufacturer striving to address the technical issues but It has taken a joint venture with the ruler of Dubai to get this far. Most products are flogging the leds and drivers close to the limit hence the regularity of failures.

I'd be choosing first a supplier with long warranty and a reputation of honouring them - a bit like an "Axminster" but for lighting, followed by make/features/price to taste.
Unless you will be running the lights all day, day after day then expect capital cost + replacements plus running costs to be more than you hoped.

I've toyed with converting to LEDS and if I do I'd will be running them from a reduced mains voltage which is easy for me as an electronic engineer but less so for others and or waiting for the phillips type designs to become widely deployed.
Running cost for me is unimportant as being an early adopter of renewable energy, my total energy bill is negative averaged over the year but I realise not everyone is that fortunate.

Bob
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Re: Dead LED panel driver

Postby novocaine » 19 Feb 2021, 15:20

I took the other approach, I know they will fail, I know it doesn't really matter how much I spent, they will fail.
so I bought cheap and cheerful and in sufficient stock that when one dies it can be replaced.

the ones in the workshop, I bought 6, I'm now down to 3, all 6 were installed as I wanted lights in specific places. not bad for 6 years and a cost I consider as acceptable (would need to look but don't think they were more than a tenner a light).
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Re: Dead LED panel driver

Postby 9fingers » 19 Feb 2021, 15:39

novocaine wrote:I took the other approach, I know they will fail, I know it doesn't really matter how much I spent, they will fail.
so I bought cheap and cheerful and in sufficient stock that when one dies it can be replaced.

The ones in the workshop, I bought 6, I'm now down to 3, all 6 were installed as I wanted lights in specific places. not bad for 6 years and a cost I consider as acceptable (would need to look but don't think they were more than a tenner a light).


That is probably a good approach Dave. Treat them as consumables. After all, we accept light bulb failure and fluorescent tube failure as part of life.
You did well at a tenner per light though espcially 6 years ago when these things were in their infancy and starting to be trendy!

Bob
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