It is currently 29 Mar 2024, 15:28

CNC Router! (Drawing Ukulele Components)

Here's the place to talk about all your table saws, bandsaws, routers and dust extractors. In fact anything that makes noise and uses electrickery.

Re: I've only gone and bought a CNC Router! Unwrapping.

Postby Malc2098 » 06 Jan 2022, 16:46

The seller is sending me three limit which were missing from the pack

They advise me some head style of screws have changed, so the overall number of screws in the pack is correct. So, I'm just waiting for the limit switches.

Quite a bit of family stuff going on, so I haven't started yet, but getting stuff ready in the background as well as trying to get my head round the various software.

I hear some of you saying you haven't got the space for one. Me, too. But, I've chosen the size that will fit on my table saw, and that becomes its bench. I'm thinking of a pulley system to hoist the machine upwards when I need the table saw.
Malcolm
User avatar
Malc2098
Sequoia
 
Posts: 7209
Joined: 03 Jul 2016, 11:10
Location: Tiverton
Name: Malcolm

Re: I've only gone and bought a CNC Router! Unwrapping.

Postby Andyp » 06 Jan 2022, 17:23

With apologies to Rory Schieder, you’re gonna need a bigger workshop.
I do not think therefore I do not am.

cheers
Andy
User avatar
Andyp
Petrified Pine
 
Posts: 11724
Joined: 22 Jul 2014, 07:05
Location: 14860 Normandy, France
Name: Andy

Re: I've only gone and bought a CNC Router! Unwrapping.

Postby Malc2098 » 06 Jan 2022, 17:27

Andyp wrote:With apologies to Rory Schieder, you’re gonna need a bigger workshop.



:lol:

We all do! So what's new?!!
Malcolm
User avatar
Malc2098
Sequoia
 
Posts: 7209
Joined: 03 Jul 2016, 11:10
Location: Tiverton
Name: Malcolm

Re: I've only gone and bought a CNC Router! Unwrapping.

Postby Andyp » 06 Jan 2022, 17:48

Malc2098 wrote:
Andyp wrote:With apologies to Rory Schieder, you’re gonna need a bigger workshop.



:lol:

We all do! So what's new?!!


Ahhh, that is so true.
I do not think therefore I do not am.

cheers
Andy
User avatar
Andyp
Petrified Pine
 
Posts: 11724
Joined: 22 Jul 2014, 07:05
Location: 14860 Normandy, France
Name: Andy

Re: I've only gone and bought a CNC Router! (Wiring?)

Postby Malc2098 » 14 Jan 2022, 17:25

The limit switches are on their way, so I've started looking at how to wire it. Being Open Source and some different boxes for multiple uses, there isn't really a definitive installation manual.

But there are several source of how others have done it, which I have viewed and read many times, so it's about time I got going.

Anyway, this is what is needed to be wired together (and some sources add even more things like contactors and breakers and….)
IMG_6421.JPG
(293.81 KiB)


I've added the mains switch top left, the power supply C13 female and male. I've supplied the connector block so that I can have the ground wires all connected to one spot and I've also supplied the on off switch for the spindle. Everything else comes in the kit.

Oh, and I've also come across wiring ferrules for the first time and a dinky little crimper for them.
Malcolm
User avatar
Malc2098
Sequoia
 
Posts: 7209
Joined: 03 Jul 2016, 11:10
Location: Tiverton
Name: Malcolm

Re: I've only gone and bought a CNC Router! (Wiring?)

Postby Robert » 14 Jan 2022, 18:14

About time too!

Only kidding I'd take my time too. Can't be too much you can wire without attaching things to the mechanical parts can there?

Looking on Ali the price has dropped around 100 and the shipping gone up by similar amount to £430 and 30 - 65 days to arrive. Winter sale yeah right. I'll wait till you are up and running to decide.

Read somewhere the water cooled spindle/router is quieter than the air cooled. be interesting when you run yours to see what you think. Got to be much better than a normal router in any case.
Robert
Old Oak
 
Posts: 2491
Joined: 21 Jul 2014, 19:31
Location: Woodford Green
Name: Robert

Re: I've only gone and bought a CNC Router! (Wiring?)

Postby 9fingers » 14 Jan 2022, 18:38

Robert wrote:Read somewhere the water cooled spindle/router is quieter than the air cooled. be interesting when you run yours to see what you think. Got to be much better than a normal router in any case.


The downside to the water cooled ones apart from plumbing, tank, pump etc is that anti freeze is essential in unheated shops. Some years back a mate of mine managed to split a casting after freezing and it was quite a job to get is clamped back up and sealed again.
His was a 3 HP or 3kW spindle and I certainly would not class it as quiet. Yes it is an induction motor so no brush noise and no forced air cooling noise but its running on 400Hz 2 pole so doing about 24000 rpm plus the noise from the cutter. Add in X Y & Z stepper noise ( 5' x 10' bed) It was difficult to talk over the composite machine noise.

Bob
Information on induction motors here
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1dBTVXx ... sp=sharing
Email:motors@minchin.org.uk
User avatar
9fingers
Petrified Pine
 
Posts: 10044
Joined: 21 Jul 2014, 20:22
Location: Romsey Hampshire between Southampton and the New Forest
Name: Bob

Re: I've only gone and bought a CNC Router! (Wiring?)

Postby RogerS » 14 Jan 2022, 19:11

Malc2098 wrote:......., there isn't really a definitive installation manual.

But there are several source of how others have done it, which I have viewed and read many times, so it's about time I got going.

....


Image

:lol: Watching with interest, Malc
If opportunity doesn't knock, build a door.
User avatar
RogerS
Petrified Pine
 
Posts: 13292
Joined: 21 Jul 2014, 21:07
Location: Nearly finished. OK OK...call me Pinocchio.
Name:

Re: I've only gone and bought a CNC Router! (Wiring?)

Postby Malc2098 » 14 Jan 2022, 19:49

Robert,

Yeah, I'm not rushing. I've done one stepper motor and keep saying to myself, red, green, blue, yellow, which is fine till you get to the female plug on the motor itself, when you have turn that upside down to make sure the colours marry with the male plug on the cable.

Bob,

I chose a 1.5 air cooled because I didn't intend doing long jobs. But from what I've heard online, these are not only far quieter than my Makita, but are far more controllable, rotational direction, speed and on/off.

Roger,

Me, too! :lol:
Malcolm
User avatar
Malc2098
Sequoia
 
Posts: 7209
Joined: 03 Jul 2016, 11:10
Location: Tiverton
Name: Malcolm

Re: I've only gone and bought a CNC Router! (Wiring?)

Postby MattS » 14 Jan 2022, 21:35

Watching with interest, I really like the idea of a CNC but really not sure I’d get the use. Can’t afford one anyway so don’t need to worry about it :lol:

Will enjoy watching you build and set it up.
MattS
Nordic Pine
 
Posts: 771
Joined: 04 Jul 2016, 10:05
Location: In the Weald of Kent
Name:

Re: I've only gone and bought a CNC Router! (More Wiring?)

Postby Malc2098 » 20 Jan 2022, 15:48

I said I wouldn't rush this, and I'm not.

The limit switches still haven't arrived. The tracking reckons they've been on the plane for a week!

And I'm still working with my electrician to come up with a safety circuit involving a contacter and momentary switches. Never heard of them before! But if there's a power cut, I don't want the motors all to fire up once it comes on again, and I need an emergency stop button so that the controller software can be held in a pause/hold condition while I resolve the issue.

Anyway, four stepper motors and the E-Stop switch wired so far.

IMG_6434.JPG
(323.51 KiB)


I've been advised to connect the shielding each end of the cable to enable a bullet connector to carry an earth wire to ground. Only trouble is, there's two schools of thought online; one is earth it a both ends and the other is earth it at one end.

Hey ho.
Malcolm
User avatar
Malc2098
Sequoia
 
Posts: 7209
Joined: 03 Jul 2016, 11:10
Location: Tiverton
Name: Malcolm

Re: I've only gone and bought a CNC Router! (More Wiring?)

Postby 9fingers » 20 Jan 2022, 16:09

You might think you have never heard of contactor, momentary switches and machines not restarting after power is restored but I bet you have them on several of your machines such as table saw, planers etc
The are usually called NVR (No Voltage Release) switches and dead common!

Watching with interest!

Bob
Information on induction motors here
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1dBTVXx ... sp=sharing
Email:motors@minchin.org.uk
User avatar
9fingers
Petrified Pine
 
Posts: 10044
Joined: 21 Jul 2014, 20:22
Location: Romsey Hampshire between Southampton and the New Forest
Name: Bob

Re: I've only gone and bought a CNC Router! (More Wiring?)

Postby Robert » 20 Jan 2022, 16:27

It there is a power cut the currently running program would be lost. Power back on might (but probably won't) run the spindle but the axes will not be homed and can't move to any coordinates.
Robert
Old Oak
 
Posts: 2491
Joined: 21 Jul 2014, 19:31
Location: Woodford Green
Name: Robert

Re: I've only gone and bought a CNC Router! (More Wiring?)

Postby Malc2098 » 20 Jan 2022, 16:55

Limit switch cables and XYZ probe wired.

IMG_6435.JPG
(262.14 KiB)


I sort of learned that about NVR switches. The safety circuit I'm trying to achieve here, is to cut the power to the VFD and hence the spindle (230v), but leave power to the controller (24vDC), so that I can reset the job.

There'll be another delay in electrical side of things while I wait for some parts. So I might start building the frame.
Malcolm
User avatar
Malc2098
Sequoia
 
Posts: 7209
Joined: 03 Jul 2016, 11:10
Location: Tiverton
Name: Malcolm

Re: I've only gone and bought a CNC Router! (More Wiring?)

Postby Robert » 20 Jan 2022, 17:06

Malc2098 wrote:The safety circuit I'm trying to achieve here, is to cut the power to the VFD and hence the spindle (230v), but leave power to the controller (24vDC), so that I can reset the job.


Can you explain that a bit more please.

How does stopping the spindle help anything? If the axes are still moving a stopped cutter will do nearly as much damage to the workpiece as a moving one. Don't you need an emergency pause button?

On the metal punching CNC that meant pressing the single step button. Then you'd have to press start for every line of gcode to progress and could sort out a bent edge or whatever at leisure. E stop was for when the sheet of metal got screwed up and the program abandoned.
Robert
Old Oak
 
Posts: 2491
Joined: 21 Jul 2014, 19:31
Location: Woodford Green
Name: Robert

Re: I've only gone and bought a CNC Router! (More Wiring?)

Postby DaveL » 20 Jan 2022, 17:28

Which controller have you got?
Regards,
Dave
My tool kit is almost complete, only a few more to get.
User avatar
DaveL
Old Oak
 
Posts: 1918
Joined: 21 Jul 2014, 21:07
Location: Sudbury, Suffolk
Name: Dave

Re: I've only gone and bought a CNC Router! (More Wiring?)

Postby Malc2098 » 20 Jan 2022, 18:34

Robert wrote:
Malc2098 wrote:The safety circuit I'm trying to achieve here, is to cut the power to the VFD and hence the spindle (230v), but leave power to the controller (24vDC), so that I can reset the job.


Can you explain that a bit more please.

How does stopping the spindle help anything? If the axes are still moving a stopped cutter will do nearly as much damage to the workpiece as a moving one. Don't you need an emergency pause button?

On the metal punching CNC that meant pressing the single step button. Then you'd have to press start for every line of gcode to progress and could sort out a bent edge or whatever at leisure. E stop was for when the sheet of metal got screwed up and the program abandoned.


Robert, I'll try. I don't think I can just have a NVR switch on the incoming power, because that would also kill the supply to the 230AC to 24DC converter supplying the controller and steppers. I need the controller to stay powered, so I can hold it in pause mode and I think so I can move the XY&Z axes while the spindle, capable of and quite often it seems runs at 24,000 rpm, needs to be shut down and stay shut down, especially after a power outage and return.

You clearly know and understand everything about your setup, but I only started learning this just before Christmas, so I am taking baby steps and willingly accept any educated advice going, but even that sometimes conflicts with others. And as the hardware and open source software is relatively new, I'm treading very carefully and slowly, and probably spending more hours reading than wiring.

Dave, it's the xPro V5. https://www.spark-concepts.com/cnc-xpro-v5/
Malcolm
User avatar
Malc2098
Sequoia
 
Posts: 7209
Joined: 03 Jul 2016, 11:10
Location: Tiverton
Name: Malcolm

Re: I've only gone and bought a CNC Router! (More Wiring?)

Postby Robert » 20 Jan 2022, 23:35

My last contact with CNC anything was 16 years ago now. We had pre built monster machines weighing 10 tons each and punching 300 holes a minute.

I've got a lot to learn before I consider joining you on this adventure. DIY machines and all that goes with it is completely different to programming and operating branded machinery.

Our first machine I wrote the gcode myself on a pad then typed it into the controller - it then saved to cassette tape!. Then we got PC software that would check the code before you ran it and show you on screen. After that came software that could read a DXF file and let you place tooling against features. That system improved over the years so I've forgotten most of the gcode commands as i stopped having to know them. None of that helps with a home built machine beyond have a grasp on the principles.

Stupid question - you have a stop button - is there a physical cycle start button...single step button etc that I remember or is it all software initiated - click go on a PC screen or similar?
Robert
Old Oak
 
Posts: 2491
Joined: 21 Jul 2014, 19:31
Location: Woodford Green
Name: Robert

Re: I've only gone and bought a CNC Router! (More Wiring?)

Postby Malc2098 » 20 Jan 2022, 23:44

Robert wrote:
Stupid question - you have a stop button - is there a physical cycle start button...single step button etc that I remember or is it all software initiated - click go on a PC screen or similar?


The coded software is passed to the controller via either a usb cable or wifi and onto a micro SD card in the controller. The laptop, connected via either of the above has a graphical interface for the machine, including a graphical eStop. I want the machine to also have an eStop, an off button and an on button, and from what I've researched, this last two go via the contactor. I haven't yet worked out a full diagram for my machine, but I will eventually and won't wire it up until it's passed by my electrician.

I'm certain graphical interface will allow a line by line execution of the gcode if you want.
Malcolm
User avatar
Malc2098
Sequoia
 
Posts: 7209
Joined: 03 Jul 2016, 11:10
Location: Tiverton
Name: Malcolm

Re: I've only gone and bought a CNC Router! (More Wiring?)

Postby novocaine » 21 Jan 2022, 08:43

check in the controller manual before you go to much further on the spindle stop Malcolm. A lot of modern controllers have a restart after power loss. unlike the good old days, the code is stored in eeprom rather than RAM, so it remembers it's last known position. It also normally starts back up in manual override to so you can jog through the code and check it's position before it starts again. I swear that black magic is at work to do this. :lol:
Carbon fibre is just corduroy for cars.
novocaine
Old Oak
 
Posts: 2560
Joined: 26 Nov 2020, 10:37
Name: Dave

Re: I've only gone and bought a CNC Router! (More Wiring?)

Postby Malc2098 » 21 Jan 2022, 12:49

novocaine wrote:check in the controller manual before you go to much further on the spindle stop Malcolm. A lot of modern controllers have a restart after power loss. unlike the good old days, the code is stored in eeprom rather than RAM, so it remembers it's last known position. It also normally starts back up in manual override to so you can jog through the code and check it's position before it starts again. I swear that black magic is at work to do this. :lol:


Thanks, Dave. The author of the controller documentation assumes a level of knowledge different from mine. :) However, I will use it and by taking baby steps, I will get there.

For you who have similar knowledge, here is that documentation.

https://github.com/Spark-Concepts/xPro-V5/wiki
Malcolm
User avatar
Malc2098
Sequoia
 
Posts: 7209
Joined: 03 Jul 2016, 11:10
Location: Tiverton
Name: Malcolm

Re: I've only gone and bought a CNC Router! (More Wiring?)

Postby Robert » 21 Jan 2022, 17:22

Interesting read at that link Malc. Only skim read some of it so far but I'll go back for more.

Some learning curve :)

Glad I can just watch at the moment!
Robert
Old Oak
 
Posts: 2491
Joined: 21 Jul 2014, 19:31
Location: Woodford Green
Name: Robert

Re: CNC Router! (Spoilboard Support Frame)

Postby Malc2098 » 23 Jan 2022, 22:22

Just while I wait for approval of my wiring diagram and waiting for electric parts, I thought I'd start building the frame.

First the spoilboard support frame. It's upside down in the photo, but that's the best way to construct it. All the parts, screws, T nuts, brackets etc., are all in separate labelled bags.

IMG_6436.JPG
(317.29 KiB)


I think it will fit just right on the tablesaw.
Malcolm
User avatar
Malc2098
Sequoia
 
Posts: 7209
Joined: 03 Jul 2016, 11:10
Location: Tiverton
Name: Malcolm

Re: CNC Router! (Linear Bearing Rails)

Postby Malc2098 » 24 Jan 2022, 19:47

Today I fitted the linear bearing rails to the Y axis beams. Had to clean a little transit oil off the rails ready to take the bearings.

EF8AE8E7-81C3-4DA4-9339-099A1651A93C.jpeg
(339.29 KiB)


The online wisdom is to clean the transit grease out of the linear bearings with Meths and then regrease with lithium grease. That'll be the next job while I wait for the grease to arrive, although I could attach the bearing rails to the X and Z axis beams tomorrow.

I've also soldered the wires to the 4 pin connecter for the spindle ensuring that the green wire was soldered to pin 4 which, when connected, is earthed to the body of the spindle.
Malcolm
User avatar
Malc2098
Sequoia
 
Posts: 7209
Joined: 03 Jul 2016, 11:10
Location: Tiverton
Name: Malcolm

Re: CNC Router! (Linear Bearing Rails)

Postby Robert » 24 Jan 2022, 23:28

I watched a couple of youtube videos of people building this brand CNC this morning. Not the full build just partial. Reviews were generally pretty good. One commented the mechanical parts had good accuracy. Also said the mechanical instructions were very good and the electrical ones not so clear to follow.

Keep posting :)
Robert
Old Oak
 
Posts: 2491
Joined: 21 Jul 2014, 19:31
Location: Woodford Green
Name: Robert

PreviousNext

Return to Machines & Power Toolery

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 14 guests