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anyone used a musclechuck?

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anyone used a musclechuck?

Postby Craig Salisbury » 10 Feb 2022, 14:21

as title.

I see the instructions are basically suck it and see for vibration, and im not really feeling buying a dial caliper setup for a router collet, i just cant seem to get it perfect, any tips?
- I am not grumpy, im pragmatic
Craig Salisbury
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Re: anyone used a musclechuck?

Postby Lurker » 10 Feb 2022, 15:16

Never heard of it, so I googled.

a solution looking for a problem IMHO.
When I bought my triton ( original company version) I bought spare brushes and collets from the triton guru called Ray ( do others remember him?) still have some unused ones.
Any problem that I have had with tool removal has been fixed with a new collet.
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Re: anyone used a musclechuck?

Postby Paisawood » 10 Feb 2022, 17:20

I'm not sure that I have any tips but I do have a muscle chuck and it works well, I bought a JessEm Router table top and lift a few years ago but found that the minimal protrusion of the collet nut above the opening meant that it was very easy to damage the table insert mounting lugs with the supplied spanners. Purchase of the musclechuck solved the problem and also made cutter changing much easier. I've never experienced any vertical movement or slipage with the 1/2 inch collet. I initially had a few problems with the 1/4 inch collet but Woodworkers Workshop sent me a replacement collet and I have had no problems since.

Setting up by trial and error was fine and I haven't had any vibration problems.

David
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Re: anyone used a musclechuck?

Postby Craig Salisbury » 10 Feb 2022, 21:49

Paisawood wrote:I'm not sure that I have any tips but I do have a muscle chuck and it works well, I bought a JessEm Router table top and lift a few years ago but found that the minimal protrusion of the collet nut above the opening meant that it was very easy to damage the table insert mounting lugs with the supplied spanners. Purchase of the musclechuck solved the problem and also made cutter changing much easier. I've never experienced any vertical movement or slipage with the 1/2 inch collet. I initially had a few problems with the 1/4 inch collet but Woodworkers Workshop sent me a replacement collet and I have had no problems since.

Setting up by trial and error was fine and I haven't had any vibration problems.

David


I think I have definitely got it to a point where its useable, but cant seem to get it perfect. im testing by running the router bursts of the lowest speed and using a cutter with a bearing to see if theres any wobble.

ugh i spose im gonna have to get a dial caliper which is a route i didnt want to go down, although ill speak to woodworkers workshop first.
- I am not grumpy, im pragmatic
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Re: anyone used a musclechuck?

Postby derekcohen » 26 Feb 2022, 14:07

I use one in my router table, which is in the outfeed of my table saw ...

Image

The router is an old Elu 177e, which would not otherwise reach above the table for changing bits. The MuscleChuck makes this an easy job. In addition, it simplifies clamping, now requiring one pint rather than two spanners.

The set up also uses a Router Raizer to raise or lower the router.

This is the upper side ...

Image

A terrific combination that offers all the bits-and-bobs for little outlay.

Regards from Perth

Derek
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Re: anyone used a musclechuck?

Postby Craig Salisbury » 26 Feb 2022, 14:13

derekcohen wrote:I use one in my router table, which is in the outfeed of my table saw ...

Image

The router is an old Elu 177e, which would not otherwise reach above the table for changing bits. The MuscleChuck makes this an easy job. In addition, it simplifies clamping, now requiring one pint rather than two spanners.

The set up also uses a Router Raizer to raise or lower the router.

This is the upper side ...

Image

A terrific combination that offers all the bits-and-bobs for little outlay.

Regards from Perth

Derek


Nice setup! I have one in my table, i just dont know whats good enough for the chuck alignment, cant seem to get it perfect with zero vibration and i have spent bloody hours on it :/
- I am not grumpy, im pragmatic
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Re: anyone used a musclechuck?

Postby derekcohen » 26 Feb 2022, 15:09

Hi Craig

The MuscleChuck can exacerbate any run out already present. I do believe that they are machined accurately for minimal vibration. Nevertheless, there is an optimum side where the balance is best. Turn the MC and test the vibration. One you find the idea spot, mark it!

What router do you have? The Elu I am using has a reputation for being very high quality. The run out is non-existent (actually, I have four Elus and they are all excellent).

With handles removed ...

Image

Regards from Perth

Derek
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Re: anyone used a musclechuck?

Postby Craig Salisbury » 26 Feb 2022, 15:23

derekcohen wrote:Hi Craig

The MuscleChuck can exacerbate any run out already present. I do believe that they are machined accurately for minimal vibration. Nevertheless, there is an optimum side where the balance is best. Turn the MC and test the vibration. One you find the idea spot, mark it!

What router do you have? The Elu I am using has a reputation for being very high quality. The run out is non-existent (actually, I have four Elus and they are all excellent).

With handles removed ...

Image

Regards from Perth

Derek


Hi Derek,

I think i spent soo long doing it may well have imagined its worse than it is :)

It seems to be ok but definitely not as smooth as without it, ill probably end up buying a dial caliper to see if i can get it better. Im using it with a Festool OF 1400 with a Jessem lift.

Cheers
Craig
- I am not grumpy, im pragmatic
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Re: anyone used a musclechuck?

Postby Eric the Viking » 27 Feb 2022, 10:18

I have a tweaked T11, which lets me do above-table(-ish) cutter changes, so I don't presently need a collet extension.

But I also have some short lengths of 1/2" and 1/4" silver steel bar, purchased from eBay very cheaply. I intended these to be used for router table setup, but haven't actually needed them very much.

They might help identify any Musclechuck runout:

REMOVE THE POWER PLUG, then put the bar in the collet, and adjust using a dial gauge (similar to how you would do it with a 4-jaw chuck on a metalworking lathe), until you get minimum runout.

My two bars are each about 9" long, which would amplify any issues nicely, and the test can be done without the router energised. You can check the barstock itself is straight by rotating that separately to see if it changes the runout. (you can still use it if slightly bent, but you then need to be more careful, and to add/subtract numbers).

Of course this only gives you a runout test, and doesn't account for weight imbalance in chuck or cutter (or both). For that you would need to run the tool (with a normal cutter in it) to see what the vibration was like.

Have to say I'm not keen on the Musclechuck concept, for the reasons Derek mentions above. It is inevitably going to add some slop, and possible collet wear. I'm switching to a thicker router plate soon though, so might change my tune!
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Re: anyone used a musclechuck?

Postby Craig Salisbury » 27 Feb 2022, 11:50

Eric the Viking wrote:I have a tweaked T11, which lets me do above-table(-ish) cutter changes, so I don't presently need a collet extension.

But I also have some short lengths of 1/2" and 1/4" silver steel bar, purchased from eBay very cheaply. I intended these to be used for router table setup, but haven't actually needed them very much.

They might help identify any Musclechuck runout:

REMOVE THE POWER PLUG, then put the bar in the collet, and adjust using a dial gauge (similar to how you would do it with a 4-jaw chuck on a metalworking lathe), until you get minimum runout.

My two bars are each about 9" long, which would amplify any issues nicely, and the test can be done without the router energised. You can check the barstock itself is straight by rotating that separately to see if it changes the runout. (you can still use it if slightly bent, but you then need to be more careful, and to add/subtract numbers).

Of course this only gives you a runout test, and doesn't account for weight imbalance in chuck or cutter (or both). For that you would need to run the tool (with a normal cutter in it) to see what the vibration was like.

Have to say I'm not keen on the Musclechuck concept, for the reasons Derek mentions above. It is inevitably going to add some slop, and possible collet wear. I'm switching to a thicker router plate soon though, so might change my tune!


ah I bought a router centering pin which essentially does the same thing i suppose, a solid surface to run against a dial indicator. Im hoping i can get it resolved sooner than later as its one of those niggling things at the back of my mind that needs a scratch every soo often and then its an hour each time playing with it.

interestingly, it screws on in replacement of the router collet as opposed it being chucked in the collet.

Cheers
Craig
- I am not grumpy, im pragmatic
Craig Salisbury
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Posts: 620
Joined: 26 Nov 2020, 09:11
Location: Corsham, Wiltshire
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