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There's few squares in making acoustic instruments.

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There's few squares in making acoustic instruments.

Postby Malc2098 » 16 Nov 2021, 22:43

I’m currently planning my next guitar projects for 2022, and finishing off the Acacia Concert Ukulele, honest! 



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The instruments I have made this century, indeed this decade have been firstly a kit, without any drawings, followed by a pair of ukuleles built solely from drawings.

What I have learned as a woodworker from making them, is that there are very few right angles that you can register from in an acoustic instrument like a guitar or ukulele. So I have given the matter some thought, and done some online research and so have learned how to use a drawing program so I can forward some files to the laser cutter man, Dave Neale of this forum, to fabricate some templates for me from acrylic.

I plan to make at least two instruments during the coming year. Two, I hear you ask. Why two? Well, why not? While some of my contemporaries spend their money on cruises, classic cars or Harley Davidsons, I spend some of mine on making musical instruments, and the tools and machines to make them.

Now, if I hand cut and hand carved two instruments from the same set of plans like I did with the ukuleles, then I would end up with two nice looking instruments, but their dimensions and even their shapes would differ. I’m not good enough to consistently create pieces of work the same every time.

This time I’ve chosen a Taylor T-910 Dreadnought 6 String Guitar for the design. Unlike the ukuleles for which not only were the plans transferred online, but if you wanted to pay, then 2D CAD files were also available, the supplier of these plans only supplied them in hard copy on 3 A0 sheets. So I’ve had to have them scanned and then ‘hand draw’ electronically the elements of the drawings to convert them into dxf files in order for Dave’s laser machine to zap them.

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That’s a whole other ball game. I tried Sketchup, of which I had got quite proficient during my workshop build, but they wanted something like a months pension for the version to export dxf files. I then tried LibreCad. I have the LibreOffice suite, so I thought I’d I’d get on with that, but either my Mac Mini or me didn’t get on with it and I eventually turned to Inkscape.

I’m doing OK. It’s a steep learning curve for a pensioner like me, but they say learn a new language or a musical instrument in your retirement to keep the grey cells going. 

Dave’s been great. I send him over a file as far as I have progressed and he can tell me if it will work for him or not, and I’m getting there.

 I have hand drawn/traced over the scan using primarily the bezier tool.

But, back to the square thing and how to register dimensions etc on something that just isn’t square.

So, the starting point is the centre line, because many instruments looked at from the front, are symmetrical. But that’s only one axis of registration. The second axis is through the centre of the sound hole, perpendicular to the longitudinal centre line. So far so good. But that means that any templates have to be transparent and have those lines etched on them and the workpieces and the jigs need these lines on them too, and I, the amateur luthier has to line them all up. 

The research showed up that if the templates, the soundboard (top), back, work board, and moulds all had coaxial holes either side of the body on the second axis line, then with a rod in each hole, everything will line up! Bingo! I got that one one from a luthier that handbuilds (so far as one can call them handbuilt these days with CNC machines, but that’s a whole other thread) his instruments and his base price starts at $15,000 for an acoustic!!! So if it’s good enough for him, who am I to argue. I’ve just got to draw all the templates so they can be laser cut, and that’s where I am now. In the middle of drawing them.

You can see the little wings with all the coaxial holes in this drawing which is in fact three different drawings on separate layers on this file; one the outline of the guitar, the next the oversize outline of the template for the back strip, and the last the oversize template for the back braces. Dave instructs me, blue lines for cutting, red lines for etching.

Full Body Template with Wings.png
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I then build up the next template one another layer. There a couple more to go.

Admin, I don't know what's going on, but on my Mac that background is white!

This WIP is just for making the templates and moulds. I’ll do a separate WIP for the instrument build.

 Oh, and did I say that I maybe even trying to invest in a CNC machine next year, so I may be calling on some of your experience and expertise.

I hope you could make sense of all that. I find articulating it here helps me make more sense of it. :)
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Re: There's few squares in making acoustic instruments.

Postby NickM » 17 Nov 2021, 08:37

It sounds complicated! It seems to share some of the difficulties of building a boat where, again, there are few square components to reference off. I suppose the lofting process in ship building is their equivalent of the templates you're making.

Keep up the good work.
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Re: There's few squares in making acoustic instruments.

Postby Dr.Al » 17 Nov 2021, 08:51

That all sounds very involved.

If you've got the drawing as a scanned image, I have some software on my PC that can convert the image into a vector drawing suitable for laser cutting automatically. It'll obviously need a fair bit of cleaning up to remove the stuff you don't want, but if you want to send it over to me then I'm happy to pass it through the tracing software and see what comes out.
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Re: There's few squares in making acoustic instruments.

Postby Peri » 17 Nov 2021, 08:56

Malc - black picture issue (I'm just copying this from a post I made elsewhere)

I'm guessing its a png file with the background set as 'transparent'.

Imagine it a a piece of clear paper with the lamp drawn on top, when you view the image the background will show whats 'underneath'.
Your viewer obviously has a white background, so it shows as white, but some software (including probably this forum) has trouble with transparencies, so it interprets the missing pixels as black.

In photoshop, if you had a photograph of say a living room, you could just drop the lamp picture on top of it, and only the lamp would show up - no need to do any manual masking.

Normal jpg's dont have mask (alpha) channels, so they are always 1 layer - 'what you see is what you get'

file.jpg
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Re: There's few squares in making acoustic instruments.

Postby Malc2098 » 17 Nov 2021, 11:19

Gents,

Thanks for your replies and offers.

Nick, it had never occurred to me that there could be similarities in boat building, yet I follow Lou in 'Tips from a Shipwright' and I should have twigged that!

Dr Al, thanks for offering the services of your surgery. I have tried the Trace Bitmap tool and like you say, there is a lot of time consuming cleaning up. So having tried tracing with the bezier tool, I found I was quicker at that than cleaning up. And with a shape like a guitar body, once I had a vertical half drawn, it's just a question of duplicating and flipping to achieve a symmetrical shape, with a bit of smoothing out and joining, of course.

Peri, thanks for that. I shall go back and have a fiddle with my png expert and see if I can get you all a white background.
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Re: There's few squares in making acoustic instruments.

Postby Malc2098 » 17 Nov 2021, 12:14

I cheated!

You might be able to see that this is several layers of drawings one on top of the others, so that the registration lines and coaxial holes stay in the same place throughout the drawing process.

Screenshot 2021-11-17 at 11.13.45.png
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Re: There's few squares in making acoustic instruments.

Postby Malc2098 » 17 Nov 2021, 12:29

Full Body Template with Wings.png
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Set background colour to white in Document Properties for Exporting as .png!

Sorted.

These ole grey cells are getting a real workout!!
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Re: There's few squares in making acoustic instruments.

Postby Malc2098 » 17 Nov 2021, 18:00

I'm getting a bit better at this drawing lark. Hopefully, you'll be able to see the different template drawings I've made so far.

This is the screen view with all layers switched on, including the drawing over which I am tracing.
All Layers over drawing.png
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First the outside body mould.
Outside Body Mold Half Template.png
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From this I can build the mould into which the bent sides are fitted. Note it's registration hole. I make two complete sides from this one template and join them together to make the whole mould.

Next the outline shape of the guitar body, including wings for the registration holes for fitting top or back over mould and template over top or back.

Full Body Original Size with wings.png
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This is the the oversize template overlaid on the previous drawing. This is what I used to create the bracing templates.
Oversize body Overlaid full body with wings.png
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The first job is to fit the centre reinforcing strip to the two back halves but jointed together. This template ensures it will central and covers the join equally. (The strip will be cross grain, perpendicular to the grain of the back halves.)
Oversize Body for Back Centre Strip.png
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This template ensures the back braces are in their correct positions and perfectly perpendicular to the centre reinforcing strip.
Oversize Body for Back Braces.png
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Note instruction to the laser man, blue for cutting, red for etching.

On to the top, or soundboard. This template ensures the X braces and cross braces are in the correct places.
Oversize body for top braces Template.png
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If I were to ask the laser man to cut a template that included the above brace positions and the following lower bout and wing braces, it would probably fall apart. So I put them on a separate template and mark their locations in pencil from this template before gluing the cross braces in place.
Oversize body for Wing and Lower Bout Braces.png
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So that's where I am so far. This might be considered overkill for one instrument, although it would ensure accuracy, but if I intend to make more than one, then it can also ensure consistency, which is what I'm after as well.
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Re: There's few squares in making acoustic instruments.

Postby AJB Temple » 17 Nov 2021, 18:45

Very nice project. I have a 910. but the CE model so with cutaway and expression system. Abalone purfling and inlays. I also have an 840 which is very similar (but older and has better wood). 910 is spruce over rosewood 2 piece back and sides. Maybe some of them were 3 piece.

If you plan to sell it, I would seriously consider getting hold of the expression system (if they are available as retro fit) or similar, and building that in, as this will make the instrument a great deal more attractive to players.

The 910 is largely a copy of a Martin D35 - they are very similar from a player perspective. Worth looking at the Martin bracing pattern as well.

Looking forward to watching you build this. Well worth sourcing top notch wood for this and being very fussy about the sound properties of spruce top. If you struggle with finding good spruce I might be able to help as I think I still have some from the 1980s.
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Re: There's few squares in making acoustic instruments.

Postby Malc2098 » 17 Nov 2021, 21:20

Thank you for those observations, Adrian.

You may recall that a previous WIP of mine was a Martin 000 kit, so I am aware of Martins X bracing.

As a hobbyist, someone is hardly like to want to buy one of my instruments, and the cost the Taylor Expressions System, would add about another £80 on top. I'm not prepared to invest that for one of my instruments until I have more building experience.

Thank you for your generous offer. Please let me know what you have. I normally source my tonewoods from a supplier in Spain, although I do have some nice old English Walnut for the back and sides of a future instrument.
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Re: There's few squares in making acoustic instruments.

Postby AJB Temple » 17 Nov 2021, 22:05

From what I have seen of the effort and care you put into your work, I think you would certainly find a buyer.

Taylor's span a huge price range these days, from a few hundred £ for the basic stuff, to £5k plus for auditorium / dreadnought models with fine grade wood. Lots of people like the dreadnought style, with or without cutaways.

You are making hand made instruments of craftsman standard. With nice inlays, good quality machine heads and nice inlays I see no reason why you should not start to build up a following for your work.

If you already have a source for wood then I will bow out. I acquired quite a lot of tonewoods etc when I was making guitars as an active hobby, and then career took over so quite a lot remains unused. The spruce is very close grained, and from Scandinavia, but the pieces I have in mind were actually coarse cut (ie not thicknessed) for grand piano soundboards and part of a job lot originally intended for Bechstein. Hence they are rather thick. All wrapped in wax paper and muslin. I had them in mind for arch tops (which I never made) but used up some for my violin making experiments.

Anyway, good luck with this, I feel a bit jealous as it brings back memories.
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Re: There's few squares in making acoustic instruments.

Postby Malc2098 » 17 Nov 2021, 22:16

Once again, thank you, but if you do want to reduce your stash, then I will give any of them a good home.
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