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It’s getting closer

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Re: It’s getting closer

Postby RogerS » 14 Sep 2021, 21:49

Christ Almighty...will no-one rid of this incompetent bumbling blonde buffoon. Relaxing everything. Figures rising. Across the board. We're at 56% of the peak. France? Spain? Well down at 15-16%. Why ? Because they are doing things properly. Masks. Vaccine passports.
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Re: It’s getting closer

Postby Lurker » 15 Sep 2021, 07:13

I think his mistake is that of hope over experience.
He keeps hoping people will act sensibly whereas we can all see that the country has a proportion of childish idiots.

On the local news last night they we saying that the three cities surrounding us,that the vaccine uptake was only 75%. So 25% still know better!
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Re: It’s getting closer

Postby novocaine » 15 Sep 2021, 07:27

It nearly feels like he is trying for herd immunity or something. But obviously not. No Definately not.
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Re: It’s getting closer

Postby Woodbloke » 15 Sep 2021, 12:12

RogerS wrote:Christ Almighty...will no-one rid of this incompetent bumbling blonde buffoon.


Calm down dear! Henry II once said something very similar in 1170 about a certain Thomas Becket and it didn’t turn out well for either party. Look on the bright side though Rog; were Boris to be hacked to death with broadswords on the steps of No.10, in due course he’d be canonised and we’d forever after remember him as St Boris :lol: - Rob
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Re: It’s getting closer

Postby Andyp » 15 Sep 2021, 12:38

We are using vaccine passports here for restaurants large and small, even out patients & visitors have to show it to gain entry to the hospital. The UK govt must know how well the passports are working in France but seem to be running scared of public opinion. A bit like ID cards.
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Re: It’s getting closer

Postby MattS » 15 Sep 2021, 13:25

I don't understand the seemingly genetic hatred most Brits have of ID cards, etc even in the face of seeing how well the vaccine passports are working abroad?
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Re: It’s getting closer

Postby Chris152 » 15 Sep 2021, 13:25

The only reason that I can think of for not reintroducing the 'light touch' measures that many scientists are suggesting is that they act as reminders of the threat the disease holds for us and are thus a barrier to a free-flowing economy. Masks are a visible measure, not a good look for relaxed shopping; strong govt guidance sticks in the mind and makes us cautious; social distancing stops the flow of people spending their money and again, puts us in a cautious state of mind. All good for protecting public health, not so good for the short-term economy. As for the medium term economy, we've all seen what happens to that when we're forced into lockdown.
And as for the NHS this winter - well, we're heading into the busiest time of year with a very large case load, schools just opened (no real NPIs in place now), universities going back soon, people heading back to the offices etc. Nobody knows what will happen, but I know where I'd place my money.
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Re: It’s getting closer

Postby Lurker » 15 Sep 2021, 13:35

MattS wrote:I don't understand the seemingly genetic hatred most Brits have of ID cards, etc even in the face of seeing how well the vaccine passports are working abroad?


I don’t think most do.
It’s would fix so many problems if we had one, mainly criminal related.
In practice we sort of do, as my plastic driver’s licence pretty much acts as one.
I have never had to show it for the purpose that it is intended for, but have needed it countless times for photo ID.
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Re: It’s getting closer

Postby sunnybob » 15 Sep 2021, 14:33

Mask wearing has nothing to do with shopping habits. Here in Cyprus mask wearing in public has been mandatory (NOT "recommended") for months.
Its a way of life, life goes on. All the shops are open and doing business.

Supermarkets, cafes, even petrol stations, you wear a mask.
I had to go to 6 physio sessions a couple of months ago, I wore a mask, the physio wore a mask. Whats the big deal?
If you are in a car that has people from more than one household, everybody has to wear a mask.

We have to show our vaccine passes every time we go into a shop or restaurant. Even our regular cafe still has to ask to see it, to know we have them with us. If the police come calling and we dont have it with us, then the restaurant gets very heavily fined (as in thousands of euros), as well as us.
No one is allowed at the bar, you wear your mask to the table, and if you go to the toilets.
No big deal, except when the English are involved, as they seem to feel they are "special". :evil:

On Saturday Cyprus carried out 70,628 tests and only found 136 positives. :eusa-dance:
Remember our total population is only 1 million.
Of the people in hospital with covid, over 85% have NOT been vaccinated.

I have my injection card showing type and date of both injections. I have my EU vaccine pass. What the hell is the big deal?

On a travel note, if anyone is intending to travel abroad, I strongly recommend you print paper copies of all tests and vaccines. We've had several visitors this last couple of months and they all report delays at check in desks with people frantically scrolling through phones to find each and every pass. One woman in a wheelchair was pushed back out of the speedy lane because of the queue building up behind her while she fought with her phone.

The mrs. went to england in july, with a whole folder of printed passes. She bought back 2 grandchildren, again, all with printed passes and documents. The customs guard actually breathed a sigh of relief and thanked her. :o
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Re: It’s getting closer

Postby Chris152 » 15 Sep 2021, 14:54

sunnybob wrote:Mask wearing has nothing to do with shopping habits. Here in Cyprus mask wearing in public has been mandatory (NOT "recommended") for months.

It certainly needn't SB, but don't forget the pickle the UK got into in the early days over mask wearing and all the heated media/ social media debates about whether they were good or bad things. Not as ridiculous as in the US, but they became a hot topic and even politicised. They've become symbols to many (did anyone else hear the contemptuous blurt/ yell from his own team as Javid dared mention in the commons that they may have to come back, yesterday?) - no calm adoption of scientific advice here... :cry:
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Re: It’s getting closer

Postby sunnybob » 15 Sep 2021, 15:33

The problem with the UK is there isnt a single politician with a spine.
I had hopes of Starmer, but no, an instant slide into obscurity.
Only anarchists (and delusionists like trump) can have any reason to not wear a mask.
Data from the every country in the entire world tells you that.
But without leadership that can make a decision, and without a police force willing to back that decision, anarchists rule and you dont have a hope in hell.
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Re: It’s getting closer

Postby Phil Pascoe » 15 Sep 2021, 16:18

Data from the every country in the entire world tells you that?
There is not one iota of data that proves any such thing. There is loads of data that proves surgical quality masks protect (mainly the wearer), but absolutely none that a piddling little piece of ill fitting dirty tissue does. Incidentally - the virus is 500 times smaller than the gaps in the weave of that tissue.
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Re: It’s getting closer

Postby RogerS » 15 Sep 2021, 16:34

Phil Pascoe wrote:Data from the every country in the entire world tells you that?
There is not one iota of data that proves any such thing. There is loads of data that proves surgical quality masks protect (mainly the wearer), but absolutely none that a piddling little piece of ill fitting dirty tissue does. Incidentally - the virus is 500 times smaller than the gaps in the weave of that tissue.



OK then perhaps you can explain why the infection rates in countries where wearing masks is mandatory are running at about 1/5 of our rate ?
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Re: It’s getting closer

Postby RogerM » 15 Sep 2021, 17:24

sunnybob wrote: ....... without leadership that can make a decision, and without a police force willing to back that decision, anarchists rule and you dont have a hope in hell.


Whoa! That way lies a police state! We already have a country where the police have harassed a dog walker in the Peak District by drone, charged 2 young women who live on their own for travelling 5 miles to meet up for a walk - plus having a picnic (which was specifically banned) because they each had a cup of legally bought take-away coffee, and then a pensioner who was known to live on his own was raided by the police where they found him with 2 of his mates sitting around a kitchen table with (shock horror) a bottle of wine. They were 3 lonely old men who had all been double jabbed. We don't need more police powers over Covid. They are already exceeding those they have.
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Re: It’s getting closer

Postby Lurker » 15 Sep 2021, 18:38

RogerM wrote:
sunnybob wrote: ....... without leadership that can make a decision, and without a police force willing to back that decision, anarchists rule and you dont have a hope in hell.


Whoa! That way lies a police state! We already have a country where the police have harassed a dog walker in the Peak District by drone, charged 2 young women who live on their own for travelling 5 miles to meet up for a walk - plus having a picnic (which was specifically banned) because they each had a cup of legally bought take-away coffee, and then a pensioner who was known to live on his own was raided by the police where they found him with 2 of his mates sitting around a kitchen table with (shock horror) a bottle of wine. They were 3 lonely old men who had all been double jabbed. We don't need more police powers over Covid. They are already exceeding those they have.


True, but the forces involved were made to back down, I doubt that happens in a police state.
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Re: It’s getting closer

Postby Blackswanwood » 15 Sep 2021, 20:02

Phil Pascoe wrote:Data from the every country in the entire world tells you that?
There is not one iota of data that proves any such thing. There is loads of data that proves surgical quality masks protect (mainly the wearer), but absolutely none that a piddling little piece of ill fitting dirty tissue does. Incidentally - the virus is 500 times smaller than the gaps in the weave of that tissue.


I have a different perspective to yours Phil.

I run big operational sites in financial services and have seen the full spectrum of opinions and beliefs held by employees over the last eighteen months. We require masks to be worn on site which some feel is controversial and I was challenged about it by an employee who let's just say has some "alternative views".

To give a full response I asked our Chief Medical Officer and a firm we have been working with on H&S what the evidence was. The advice was that there has been a dearth of reliable scientific research on the topic until very recently.

A study carried out by a consortium of researchers between November 2020 and April 2021 enrolled 350,000 people across 600 villages in Bangladesh. Half of the villages selected at random received either cloth or surgical masks. Community leaders encouraged participation in the trial.

A quick Google search will show the detailed results but ...

"The interventions tripled the proportion of people who wore masks correctly. Overall, in the villages where the team distributed masks, symptomatic infections were 9.3% lower. Where surgical masks were given out, the results were even better: infections dropped by 11%. Older people benefited most: symptomatic COVID-19 in people over 60 went down by 35% in the villages using surgical masks."
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Re: It’s getting closer

Postby Phil Pascoe » 15 Sep 2021, 21:13

RogerS wrote:
Phil Pascoe wrote:Data from the every country in the entire world tells you that?
There is not one iota of data that proves any such thing. There is loads of data that proves surgical quality masks protect (mainly the wearer), but absolutely none that a piddling little piece of ill fitting dirty tissue does. Incidentally - the virus is 500 times smaller than the gaps in the weave of that tissue.



OK then perhaps you can explain why the infection rates in countries where wearing masks is mandatory are running at about 1/5 of our rate ?


All Countries with mandatory masks? Are their methods of recording infection thae same? Are their habits the same? Are they less or more crowded? Is their social distancing better? Do they go out as often? Are they warmer Countries, therefore with probably better ventilated indoor spaces? Do they all have the same variants? Are they wearing silly little pieces of tissue or proper masks? There are so many variables, you could probably attribute it to eating more fish or something if you wanted to.
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Re: It’s getting closer

Postby sunnybob » 15 Sep 2021, 21:31

I take it you dont wear a mask?
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Re: It’s getting closer

Postby RogerS » 15 Sep 2021, 21:36

sunnybob wrote:I take it you dont wear a mask?


Apparently they aren't worth wearing.
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Re: It’s getting closer

Postby MY63 » 16 Sep 2021, 08:03

RogerS wrote:
sunnybob wrote:I take it you dont wear a mask?


Apparently they aren't worth wearing.


I still have nightmares about masks, Roger they might not be worth wearing but they are the only protection you have.
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Re: It’s getting closer

Postby RogerS » 16 Sep 2021, 08:25

MY63 wrote:
RogerS wrote:
sunnybob wrote:I take it you dont wear a mask?


Apparently they aren't worth wearing.


I still have nightmares about masks, Roger they might not be worth wearing but they are the only protection you have.


I totally agree, Michael. I was being sarcastic.

What those who seek to denigrate the effectiveness of masks are missing is one very (IMO) behavioural outcome. Namely, the wearing of a mask is a constant visible reminder that Covid is still out there and so should remind people to remain vigilant and adopt all the other measures.
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Re: It’s getting closer

Postby Phil Pascoe » 16 Sep 2021, 08:47

MY63 wrote:
RogerS wrote:
sunnybob wrote:I take it you dont wear a mask?


Apparently they aren't worth wearing.


I still have nightmares about masks, Roger they might not be worth wearing but they are the only protection you have.


The only protection others have from you? No one has even pretended they protect you.
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Re: It’s getting closer

Postby Lurker » 16 Sep 2021, 08:54

Phil Pascoe wrote:
The only protection others have from you? No one has even pretended they protect you.



Correct!
I wear one as a curtesy to others and live in the hope that this is reciprocated .
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Re: It’s getting closer

Postby MY63 » 16 Sep 2021, 09:25

Sorry I should have said we instead of you.
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Re: It’s getting closer

Postby RogerS » 16 Sep 2021, 10:45

Lurker wrote:
Phil Pascoe wrote:
The only protection others have from you? No one has even pretended they protect you.



Correct!
I wear one as a curtesy to others and live in the hope that this is reciprocated .


:text-+1: :text-goodpost:
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