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Panasonic Lumix DC-FZ82

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Re: Panasonic Lumix DC-FZ82

Postby Eric the Viking » 22 Jun 2022, 12:15

This is the best I can do in a rush:
P1010337.jpg
Cropped, slight desaturation, sharpened and denoised slightly (full scale)
(393.66 KiB)

If I had time, I'd mask out the hare and apply specific noise reduction and sharpening to it, separately from the background. for some reason Panasonic files are huge though and slow up on my machine too much for this to be practical in AfterShot 3 (I have other stuff running I cannot shut down presently). Raw Therapee is more efficient but I don't know it as well as I do AfterShot.

Note that when using a raw file, things like colour balance and contrast aren't fixed in the original image - there's metadata telling you what the camera thinks is correct, but you get pretty much what the sensors got, unmolested. Much more adjustment is possible than with jpeg files, as no choices were made automatically before the image arrived in the editor. So you have more control and leeway, usually.

That said, this image has two biggies (From the EXIF metadata: ISO 80, 1/125 sec shutter, f/6, at 200mm focal length*):

1. sensor noise: given there's plenty of light this is the controlling issue. It's making any kind of NR/sharpening really hard to do, surprisingly so.

2. camera shake: there is sufficient to lose detail like the hare's whiskers. The two images below (1:1 screengrabs from AfterShot) show the problem - the hay blade at the animal's hind leg has obvious blur, and the whiskers were obviously optically sharp (2nd image), but not captured as such. It's not clear if this is the shutter/mirror (does it have either?) or it being handheld.
hare-cam-shake.png
Hay stalk detail
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hare-cam-shake2.png
Whisker detail
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The camera has a tiny sensor, so if this is actual focal length, the optical zoom would be at well over 1000mm for a full 35mm frame sensor. A prime lens for my 6D of that length would be north of $30,000 (Canon don't make one!), so it's a huge ask for a bridge camera.

That said, in the old chemical-camera world it was a thing that, to handhold you should choose a shutter speed 1/focal length in mm or faster, to keep camera shake to an acceptable level. Otherwise choices are either tripod/monopod, beanbag or increase the shutter speed and ISO setting. I guess the lens is already wide open (EXIF: f/5.9).
Try some camera shake experiments:
  • Find a static subject, such as a sign, outdoors at a decent distance.
  • Start with a similar ISO and shutter speed to the hare pic.
  • Try increasing the shutter to around 1/1000 or higher, leaving the camera on shutter priority (so it adjusts aperture and ISO as necessary).
  • Find the slowest shutter speed you think is sufficiently sharp, and bear that in mind when zoomed right in handheld.
  • If the camera has anti-shake of some sort, try it both on and off. This will tell you how much you gain, and what if any are the artefacts.
Canon put the image stabilization in the lenses (making them silly-expensive, as you buy the tech with every lens!). On my 300mm prime it's very good (worth about 1 f-stop), but when over-stretched you get some nasty artefacts.

Good camera bags make excellent beanbags too. I used one like this for years:
Image
Ebay photo - the item is here.
It is intended to go under a rucksack (there's a waist belt and hip pads built in). The soft top is ideal as a beanbag, and the lid's overhanging bits fold upwards so lenses don't roll off when you swap them over. I've changed lenses in all sorts of conditions and never dropped one off the top of the bag. It also cushions a camera perfectly.

Overall it's an excellent design and I've had several very like it - my first one was sold to me by the MD/owner of CCS back in the 1980s when the company was tiny, based in Clevedon, Somerset. They got their break selling custom bags to the BBC Nat Hist Unit for film cameramen to take round the world doing Attenborough series.

In the digital age I've had to move on to a larger bag, which is annoying, but it's still CCS (I have a collection of them now). I haven't bought a brand new one since the first though! They're very rugged and extremely good value secondhand, although there are now far too many models on the secondhand market to choose from.

Finally, I've tried to find a good crop for that image. This is very much personal choice (I'm a fan of dividing thirds, etc.), but bear in mind cropping also means reducing the information content of the image - in effect making the pixels bigger.

With a bridge camera you really need to get close to filling the frame with the subject if you can, otherwise you'll run into detail issues like the above.


*not sure if this is actual 200mm or converted to '35mm equivalent' I suspect it's actual, having looked on the DPreview site..
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Re: Panasonic Lumix DC-FZ82

Postby AJB Temple » 22 Jun 2022, 13:03

I will see you in a couple of weeks or so Andy, so bring your memory cards with the RAW files on and you can see in practice how RAW processors handle them. We can do some shots of the same thing using your camera hand held and on a pro tripod, and compare the same thing with a full frame camera and the longest lens we have (belongs to my wife in fact) and also a cheap crop frame camera such as an EOS 450D (available off the Bay, with lens etc for about £100 - £140 ish).

This will illustrate all the things Eric has described perfectly above.
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Re: Panasonic Lumix DC-FZ82

Postby Andyp » 22 Jun 2022, 19:02

Another school day Eric. Thanks for taking the time. A lot for me to digest there.
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Re: Panasonic Lumix DC-FZ82

Postby Andyp » 13 Aug 2022, 08:22

I'm still plodding along trying to get the most out of the camera, which I stupidly forgot to take to the UK a few weeks back so was unable to take Adrian up on his offer of help. Next time perhaps.

Nothing special here but as storks are few and far between in the UK I thought I would share this.

44691D25-D19D-4960-9376-1EB5DDE00DDE.jpeg
(751.46 KiB)


On the same walk I also sat and watched this hare for about 5 mins as he slowly ambled his way towards me.

D7DDB203-9CE2-4AC0-92E9-FB2536C91CD6.jpeg
(600.03 KiB)


Tried in vain to get a decent shot of the sturgeon moon last night. No sign of the persids here either. With a near full moon the sky was far to bright in the only direction I could point the camera at.

2B69D812-FBD7-4280-9131-8452E8B51CD7.jpeg
(141.74 KiB)


And lastly down on the marais there is little sign of the drought affecting other parts of the country.

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(420.61 KiB)


The drainage ditches are nearly all bone dry but still plenty of water flowing from the nearby village springs that drain that way.
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Re: Panasonic Lumix DC-FZ82

Postby AJB Temple » 14 Aug 2022, 15:18

Indeed Andy. Next time. I assumed you just wanted to duck me seeing your photos :lol:
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Re: Panasonic Lumix DC-FZ82

Postby Gill » 16 Aug 2022, 03:10

Lumix DC-TZ200. It looked like such a cute little dog so I took out my travel camera, which I usually have with me when I don't have my full frame camera. Then the little so-and-so turned its bum to me, cocked its leg and blew a raspberry, all at the same time. Lumix/Panasonics are great little cameras for capturing these moments.

Image

Yes, I know there are technical issues with this image. It doesn't matter to me. Get the image and worry about the rest of the details on cold winter nights when you've got nothing better to do than browse through old photos. The more images you take, the more your photography will improve. Don't overthink things. Just be ready for the image you would otherwise miss.

I was surprised to see the City of Lincoln Lancaster bomber fly over me on Saturday. Bearing in mind I'd been snapping the full moon the previous evening, I couldn't resist a bit of composite editing inspired by the idea of a 'bombers moon'. It's a good job I already had the basic images in the bag.

Image


Love the hare, Andy. :eusa-clap:
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Re: Panasonic Lumix DC-FZ82

Postby Andyp » 16 Aug 2022, 07:13

Thanks Gill.

When I upgrade the iMac I might like to have a go at composite editing.
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Re: Panasonic Lumix DC-FZ82

Postby Andyp » 17 Aug 2022, 09:00

I bought this camera with the desire to get closer to the local wildlife. Today I achieved what I had in mind from the outset .
I do not expect any prizes for image quality but I am pleased with these results with just a little editing in Photos on the iPad.

It was raining so camera was in it’s bag and under my waterproof. Jeez velcro is noisy when you are trying to make as little noise as possible. Dog was also off his lead but impeccably well behaved.

Male and female roe deer. About 40-50 yards away.

DCDBF0AB-F5EA-4EC4-8F1E-10F181BD64C9.jpeg
(570.71 KiB)


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(639.28 KiB)


40260F70-237F-41EC-B0D1-32A0C8ACBE39.jpeg
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Re: Panasonic Lumix DC-FZ82

Postby RogerS » 17 Aug 2022, 09:04

Nice photos. If you get yourself a bright orange waterproof then they won't see you that easily. Counter-intuitive, I now, but they can't differentiate orange from green.
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Re: Panasonic Lumix DC-FZ82

Postby Gill » 17 Aug 2022, 12:54

Smashing photos, Andy. Well done :eusa-clap: .

I was talking to the wildlife photographer Chris Weston last year. (Clang!) He told me the colour of clothing makes no difference whatsoever. What is important is that the local wildlife should be familiar with your scent. He will often wear old t shirts and put them unwashed on the site of his next photoshoot each day over the preceding week. He also likes to position himself somewhere that the animal would not expect a predator to be.

I'll see if I can find the notes I made after our conversation and send them to you.
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Re: Panasonic Lumix DC-FZ82

Postby RogerS » 17 Aug 2022, 13:11

Sorry to disagree with you, Gill, but it's all explained here.

https://www.shootinguk.co.uk/shooting/d ... see-112852
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Re: Panasonic Lumix DC-FZ82

Postby Andyp » 17 Aug 2022, 15:14

For the record I was wearing a blue wind/shower proof, blue jeans and a grey cap and yesterday’s shirt as I walk the dog before having a shower in the morning and was partially hidden behind a metal gate, hedge and long grass. :)

I dislike bright orange waterproofs which remind me too much of long lines of ramblers spoiling the view while hiking in otherwise pristine Scottish wilderness. I know there is a safety aspect to bright colours but lines of dozens of orange dots on the side of some remote glen really spoil the view.
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Re: Panasonic Lumix DC-FZ82

Postby Gill » 17 Aug 2022, 15:26

The article isn’t available unless you sign up for their newsletter, Roger. I'm not going to do that! I’m not disputing your assertion about colour perception, just passing on the advice given to me by a renowned international wildlife photographer about how to induce wildlife to accept your presence without perceiving you as a threat.
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Re: Panasonic Lumix DC-FZ82

Postby AJB Temple » 17 Aug 2022, 21:11

Interesting subject. My wife and I did a (slightly annoying) course for several days with a well known pro wildlife photographer in Wales several years ago. He was very much in Gill's camp. Part of it was that to get the best pictures, getting as close as you can is helpful. Avoiding disturbing creatures that will tip off your target is helpful too.

Maybe deer don't see orange in the way we do, but perhaps other animals who may alarm the dee, do. That said I have never done any animal stalking with a view to killing them.
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Re: Panasonic Lumix DC-FZ82

Postby spb » 17 Aug 2022, 22:03

I suspect a part of the bright orange thing is that when hunting, you want to be near-invisible to the deer yet very obvious to any other hunters that might be in the area. Taking advantage of the deer's colour-blindness is the easiest way to do that, and let you get your shot in while not getting shot accidentally by someone else. You're also not generally aiming to get that close to them (i.e. far enough away that staying downwind negates the need to do anything about scent), partly for the same reason.

If you don't need to be extremely visible to other humans, then you need different methods to get closer up and get the other kind of shot.
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Re: Panasonic Lumix DC-FZ82

Postby RogerS » 17 Aug 2022, 22:29

Gill wrote:The article isn’t available unless you sign up for their newsletter, Roger. I'm not going to do that! I’m not disputing your assertion about colour perception, just passing on the advice given to me by a renowned international wildlife photographer about how to induce wildlife to accept your presence without perceiving you as a threat.


Not sure what's going on there, Gill..but I'm definitely not signed up to their newsletter ! I simply Googled and found the site.
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Re: Panasonic Lumix DC-FZ82

Postby Andyp » 08 Feb 2023, 09:52

I thought that it was too cold to take the camera with me this morning. I should have known better.
How many opportunities will I ever get to photograph a water vole out of water. Grrrr. Taken with the phone.
His mate dived through the very thin ice, the sound of which made me turn around. When this chap tried he got a bruised nose, funny to watch.

8CF764AF-57A7-466D-90E2-FDDC25F9D7B5.jpeg
(263.42 KiB)


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Re: Panasonic Lumix DC-FZ82

Postby RogerS » 08 Feb 2023, 10:15

Wow...I'd enter that into a wildlife photography competition. You seem to have had a very long cold spell to freeze that water over or is it non-flowing ?

Talking of serendipitous photography. A friend sent me this photo

plane nosedive.png
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Re: Panasonic Lumix DC-FZ82

Postby novocaine » 08 Feb 2023, 10:16

oh look, a penny............
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Re: Panasonic Lumix DC-FZ82

Postby Andyp » 08 Feb 2023, 11:22

-4⁰c overnight, 7⁰c yesterday afternoon, so hardly a prolonged cold spell. There is a slight flow from a spring in the village a mile or so away in what is mainly a drainage ditch. Ice not at all thick as another vole dived through it.
Quality I fear not good enough for competition but it was fun to watch for a few minutes.
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Re: Panasonic Lumix DC-FZ82

Postby RogerS » 08 Feb 2023, 16:48

novocaine wrote:oh look, a penny............


Lest anyone be lead into thinking that the photo is not genuine, it certainly is and that really is a Lightning in a nose-dive and the pilot plummetting to earth - he survived. The farmer looking back was his reaction at hearing the 'Bang' from the ejector seat.
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Re: Panasonic Lumix DC-FZ82

Postby Cabinetman » 08 Feb 2023, 18:02

RogerS wrote:
novocaine wrote:oh look, a penny............


Lest anyone be lead into thinking that the photo is not genuine, it certainly is and that really is a Lightning in a nose-dive and the pilot plummetting to earth - he survived. The farmer looking back was his reaction at hearing the 'Bang' from the ejector seat.


Do you know whereabouts it was Roger? Wheels are down so presumably near an airfield, We had a fast reaction base near me at Binbrook in Lincolnshire, if it was there the Pilots boots were probably nailed up in the Blacksmith Arms, as were all the other ejected airmen survivors boots, good pub, happy times I got to know a few of them well.
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Re: Panasonic Lumix DC-FZ82

Postby RogerS » 08 Feb 2023, 18:07

Cabinetman wrote:
RogerS wrote:
novocaine wrote:oh look, a penny............


Lest anyone be lead into thinking that the photo is not genuine, it certainly is and that really is a Lightning in a nose-dive and the pilot plummetting to earth - he survived. The farmer looking back was his reaction at hearing the 'Bang' from the ejector seat.


Do you know whereabouts it was Roger? Wheels are down so presumably near an airfield, We had a fast reaction base near me at Binbrook in Lincolnshire, if it was there the Pilots boots were probably nailed up in the Blacksmith Arms, as were all the other ejected airmen survivors boots, good pub, happy times I got to know a few of them well.
The Lightning’s all had scraped bums from having the stick pulled back as soon as was possible, off to see to the Russians and to see them off!
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Happy to help, Ian.

The full skinny is here

https://theaviationgeekclub.com/the-sto ... terceptor/
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Re: Panasonic Lumix DC-FZ82

Postby Cabinetman » 08 Feb 2023, 19:45

Thanks Roger, very interesting.
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Re: Panasonic Lumix DC-FZ82

Postby Andyp » 13 Feb 2023, 20:46

Once again I did not take the Lumix out with me this morning. It was foggy and below freezing. So this was taken with the phone. I am not sure if I could have bettered it with the Lumix. After taking my gloves off to take the photo they were still freezing when I got home 20 mins later

With just a little editing I am very pleased with this.

Oak tree & foggy sunrise
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