Home pub panelling

[Tangsoodo]

Hi I’ve currently got a double garage that I’ve converted into a pub. It is plaster boarded but I now want to make some wall panelling out of plywood. I want to stain it dark colour like a traditional British pub but I’m going around in circles deciding what to use. I’ve experimented with Colron dark oak and furniture clinic dark out stains but I can’t seem to get that nice expensive hardwood look. I think it needs a gloss top coat but do I just use something like dark oak Ronseal diamond interior varnish or something like a coloured stain and gloss or satin top coat of something. I’ve attached a pic of the type of thing I’m after but maybe a more brown than mahogany

 

[Cabinetman]

Hi Steve and welcome. Looking at your photo I think If it were me I would be aiming for the colour of the snooker table, but that’s just personal preference. I’ve always used Rustins wood dyes with water based poly Varnish on top but the thought of trying to stain both the ply and the Pine? so that it all looks the same is a bit off putting tbh. The dyes can be mixed successfully to get the exact colour you want, but they don’t come alive till you get a top coat on.
Whatever you get a recommendation for from the others I would test finish before going too far. DamhIk!
Ian

 

[Mike G]

Welcome Steve.

I spent years, if not decades, trying to do what you want to do: make pine or similar look like old oak. I tried absolutely everything. Even if you achieve something like the colour you want, you will always see the grain, and it will always look like stained pine or ply.........and it will change over time anyway, meaning that is the pine matches the ply when you finish, it won't in a year or two. I'm afraid the only way is to use oak. Oak veneered MDF is relatively cheap, and oak boards aren't silly money, so I would suggest you do it in oak, and you'll not be wanting to rip it out and start again in a year or two.

I mix my own finish (oil, varnish, white spirit 1:1:1......slap it on, wait 10 minutes, wipe it off. Repeat every 24 hours until you get the look you want), but Ian's suggestion is perfectly good too.

 

[AndyP]

Welcome to the forum Steve.
I hope you find a solution as I would love to see a garage pub conversion.

 

[Tangsoodo]

Thanks all. I will look into oak veneered mdf first but I might try Ian’s suggestion on a piece of hardwood ply and see how it comes out. All depends on the budget.

 

[thetyreman]

I would look at buying some ash and staining it a mahogany colour, it can look surprisingly close to oak with the right stain, it should be cheaper than oak as well, at the very least use a hardwood for the frames, agree with mike, it's just not possible to make pine look like a hardwood, having also tried to do it.

 

[AJB Temple]

Edit - Tyreman posted as I was writing.

Hardwood ply generally refers to the core. Unless you pay serious money you are not going to get a hardwood surface that will remotely take a finish that will look like proper oak panels. You can buy oak veneered ply without patches, but it will be multiples of the price of oak veneered MDF. Very good quality ply is now super expensive due to the war between Russia and Ukraine.

You are searching for the holy grail in trying to make anything but oak look like oak.

It is MUCH easier and cheaper to make panelling out of MDF (primed with proper MDF primer) and glued on raised panels. Edge finishing takes some work but painted panelling, done well, looks excellent. With a durable paint (I use Mylands personally) it is washable and very hard wearing. It is also cheap and easy to do.

As you have converted a double garage, I presume you will insulate behind the panelling and fix the panels to stud? Very worthwhile if you have not built that into your plan. Bear in mind damp ingress and vapour too.

 

[Dr.Al]

Sweet chestnut is another option if you're looking for cheaper hardwood. It's sometimes referred to as "Poor Man's Oak". It's a little lighter than oak but quite a bit cheaper & looks fairly similar. Nice to work with too.

If you're in Worcestershire then Wentwood Timber isn't that far from you and they seem very good value if you're happy to work with rough sawn stock. They usually have sweet chestnut, ash & oak in stock.

 

[meccarroll]

Water stains can give a deep rich colour. I'm with the rest that you need to use oak if you want it to look like oak. As already mentioned Ash and chestnut can look very similar to oak. If I had the job I would consider using veneered MDF and or veneered Ply and just cut strips to simulate the framework fit panels in grooves in the frame then use a small bead to cover the edges. You could pre-finiah all the panels before assembly and the bead too. If you stain pine dark it will still look like pine that has been stained dark which is ok if that look is acceptable to you but if you want the panels to look like hardwood you really need to use hardwood.

 

[Tangsoodo]

Ok first of all I really do appreciate all of you that have taken the time to reply. I can see now that if I want oak I need to buy oak and even with veneer ash or oak it’s looking like hundreds of pounds for the area that I will need to cover. I was always intending to put ply up and also frame with ply so there wasn’t going to be any pine to worry about matching the stain but I can see now that I’m not going to get the “posh” finish with normal ply. I think I’m going to have to have a rethink and forget about the polished oak look and go more like the very dark verging on black ( but not black) that they sometimes use in pubs. It’s used almost every evening by my lads and their mates un their 20s so not much point in making it too expensive. Just wanted it looking more traditional. I will try and get some photos of it tomorrow to show what I’m dealing with and maybe you will have some pointers for me.

 

[9fingers]

This is ash stained with med oak spirit stain. The ash has a bit busier grain but in some pieces I prefer it to oak.

 

[AndyT]

Although I agree that you can't easily fake oak, here's one way to get a nice dark colour, which might be economical on a large area.

A while back I made a little box from old, unidentified softwood. I stained it with old fashioned Van Dyke crystals and was quite pleased with the colour. I expect it would fade in bright sunlight but might be ok in a converted garage.

A little "Victorian" box from old wood with old tools

With the glue thoroughly dry I turned my efforts to tidying up some of the careless mess I had made :oops: . First, the outside of the box got planed all round. I always like this stage with dovetails - they immediately look neater, especially if you turn the best corner towards the...

www.thewoodhaven2.co.uk

I bought the stain from "Endless Green" on eBay.

 

[Tangsoodo]

@9fingers that grain does look good. @AndyT that looks really good, definitely that rich pub colour. Could I put a poly over it to give it a bit of protection. I’ve just put a second coat of Ronseal walnut on a scrap of ply but I think yours looks better.

 

[Mike G]

Colour and finish are 2 different things. Not only can you, but you must, put something over the top. Your issue, though, is that it's always going to be ply. Dark shiny ply will look like dark shiny ply, rather than oak panelling.

 

[AndyT]

Yes, like Mike says, you'd need something on top of the stain to stop it rubbing off and to give the colour some depth. I used shellac but poly would be good too.

 

[Tangsoodo]

Just for reference for other people searching here is my scrap ply with Ronseal walnut with 3 coats. Was just trying it along with other stains. I’m going to order some van dyke to try.

 

[AJB Temple]

Looks good.

 

[wallace]

Have you thought about colored wax, I made my front door in ash and waxed it internally, I suppose it has an oakish look. Ill get a pic

 

[Raymedullary]

I too would be looking at painting rather than attempting to stain plywood which as said above in various ways, wont look anything like authentic.

 

[wallace]

This is ash finished in oak wax,

 

[AJB Temple]

It's odd how people selling finishes describe dark wax as "oak" colour. Oak is very light and doesn't look at all brown, and melted beeswax is light beige. Marketing!

 

[9fingers]

It's odd how people selling finishes describe dark wax as "oak" colour. Oak is very light and doesn't look at all brown, and melted beeswax is light beige. Marketing!

A lot of finishes seem to be available as light, medium and dark oak. I tend to go for Medium as it fits well with other furniture we have.

 

[Tangsoodo]

How do you find wax wears. Years ago In a previous house I fitted new stair spindles, door frames and skirting and waxed it all in medium oak briswax. It looked good but I found it didn’t wear too will. It gets dirty where hands touched it a lot on the stairs and if you spilt water on it, it would leave water bead marks if not cleared up straight away

 

[wallace]

It's odd how people selling finishes describe dark wax as "oak" colour. Oak is very light and doesn't look at all brown, and melted beeswax is light beige. Marketing!

I think when people think of oak they think of church pews, originally pews were never stained and naturally became brown over many years of use. Thats what I read in an old copy of woodworker from the 70's.

How do you find wax wears. Years ago In a previous house I fitted new stair spindles, door frames and skirting and waxed it all in medium oak briswax. It looked good but I found it didn’t wear too will. It gets dirty where hands touched it a lot on the stairs and if you spilt water on it, it would leave water bead marks if not cleared up straight away

I made my front door about 7years ago and it has held up really well, I also made skirting in ash which gets a wet mop ran against it every other day whilst I'm cleaning the parquet, thats covered in rustons which is indistructable.

 

[Lons]

What the others said, you either have to accept that ply will always look like ply or spend some money using veneered mdf. surprisingly good, I've made furniture panelled carcases from it. or the expensive solid oak route.
There is one other option if you want a plank look, still not cheap and that's packs of engineered flooring which you can get unfinished or pre finished. As oak is the most popular there are always loads of choice and prices.