New track saw on the block - Hilti

[AJB Temple]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VvRkOEtSWY4

Looks the business.

 

[Doug]

I saw the Hilti a couple of weeks ago & to be honest I think they are beyond slow to the party, it’s finished, the cleaners are at work & even the drunkest stragglers are sober & in McDonald’s :lol:

If I was going to spend that sort of money I’d opt for the new Festool TSV 60 KEBQ which is a real game changer in tracksaws & I imagine the one the other brands will be playing catch up with.



I got to try it out back in February down in Bury st Edmond’s & the quality of cut is unbelievable, the diamond scoring blade not only gives a perfect finish cut on the track side of the panel but also on the waste side meaning when breaking down panels your good to use the waste side cut as a new edge, not only a material saver but a time saver as well. Definitely the next tracksaw I’ll be buying

 

[meccarroll]

I saw the Hilti a couple of weeks ago & to be honest I think they are beyond slow to the party, it’s finished, the cleaners are at work & even the drunkest stragglers are sober & in McDonald’s :lol:

If I was going to spend that sort of money I’d opt for the new Festool TSV 60 KEBQ which is a real game changer in tracksaws & I imagine the one the other brands will be playing catch up with.



I got to try it out back in February down in Bury st Edmond’s & the quality of cut is unbelievable, the diamond scoring blade not only gives a perfect finish cut on the track side of the panel but also on the waste side meaning when breaking down panels your good to use the waste side cut as a new edge, not only a material saver but a time saver as well. Definitely the next tracksaw I’ll be buying

It all sounds very nice Doug, but what a price tag £840! I have managed to resist buying a track saw so far managing with a battery operated Skill Saw and thin kerf blade for fine cuts. I use a piece of ply about 200mm wide and screwed a piece of batten on to it to form a guide for the cutting edge and it works for what I do. If I was doing a lot of kitchens with laminated board then the Festool sounds like the des res of track saws.

 

[AJB Temple]

The Festool looks very good Doug. Would be interested to see the bottom cut quality on BB ply. Fully agree that Hilto are really late to the game, but generally their tools are pretty good in my experience (I have their big circular saw, bought s/h from a young timber framer who gave up).

My own is a Mafell MT55, which I preferred to the Festool at the time, and I doubt I will ever need to replace it. The scoring aspect is excellent and with a good sharp blade it has very little trouble doing a clean top and bottom cut on ply, but just occasionally there is a little ragging on the bottom.

For me a good track saw is an essential piece of kit. We bought mine to make our own kitchen originally. Must have done at least a hundred sheets of ply, MDF, cement board, and a lot of oak floor board trimming in house renovation over the last few years. Because I generally set up a 8 by 4 trestle worktable in the area where I am working, the track saw is ideal and is extremely accurate. I can't handle big sheets in my workshop and I don't have a good table saw either. Currently making a room dividing wall / built in cupboard and the tracksaw is indispensable for that.

 

[Doug]

I saw the Hilti a couple of weeks ago & to be honest I think they are beyond slow to the party, it’s finished, the cleaners are at work & even the drunkest stragglers are sober & in McDonald’s :lol:

If I was going to spend that sort of money I’d opt for the new Festool TSV 60 KEBQ which is a real game changer in tracksaws & I imagine the one the other brands will be playing catch up with.



I got to try it out back in February down in Bury st Edmond’s & the quality of cut is unbelievable, the diamond scoring blade not only gives a perfect finish cut on the track side of the panel but also on the waste side meaning when breaking down panels your good to use the waste side cut as a new edge, not only a material saver but a time saver as well. Definitely the next tracksaw I’ll be buying

It all sounds very nice Doug, but what a price tag £840! I have managed to resist buying a track saw so far managing with a battery operated Skill Saw and thin kerf blade for fine cuts. I use a piece of ply about 200mm wide and screwed a piece of batten on to it to form a guide for the cutting edge and it works for what I do. If I was doing a lot of kitchens with laminated board then the Festool sounds like the des res of track saws.

I’ve two tracksaws at the mo & couldn’t work without them especially when cutting panelling both kitchen & bathroom particularly the gloss stuff but like any tool it’s only of use if you have a job for it.

 

[Doug]

The Festool looks very good Doug. Would be interested to see the bottom cut quality on BB ply. Fully agree that Hilto are really late to the game, but generally their tools are pretty good in my experience (I have their big circular saw, bought s/h from a young timber framer who gave up).

My own is a Mafell MT55, which I preferred to the Festool at the time, and I doubt I will ever need to replace it. The scoring aspect is excellent and with a good sharp blade it has very little trouble doing a clean top and bottom cut on ply, but just occasionally there is a little ragging on the bottom.

For me a good track saw is an essential piece of kit. We bought mine to make our own kitchen originally. Must have done at least a hundred sheets of ply, MDF, cement board, and a lot of oak floor board trimming in house renovation over the last few years. Because I generally set up a 8 by 4 trestle worktable in the area where I am working, the track saw is ideal and is extremely accurate. I can't handle big sheets in my workshop and I don't have a good table saw either. Currently making a room dividing wall / built in cupboard and the tracksaw is indispensable for that.

I agree Hilti have a great reputation & I’m sure their die hard users will buy it but it seems strange to me to bring out a saw in an already crowded market the doesn’t have an new outstanding features.

I have both the Mafell & Festool saws & both are excellent the cordless Mafell is used on site & the Festool is permanently in the workshop as I don’t have room for a panel saw & I break down a lot of sheet materials.
Track saws have been a game changer for me especially in the work I now take on.

 

[Trevanion]

I have managed to resist buying a track saw so far managing with a battery operated Skill Saw and thin kerf blade for fine cuts.

It's one of those things you can do without but once you've got one you're constantly saying "how did I used to be able to work without this?" I don't use my Makita particularly often as I don't work with sheets on a regular basis and try to avoid work that involves sheets, but it's been very useful for a large number of jobs that would've been tricky otherwise.

One that comes to mind was that it was very useful on a flat roof I did a couple of years ago, doing the very shallow birdsmouths in the roof timbers so that it sat well on the wallplate. I could've done it with a regular circular saw and I suspect most carpenters would, but the tracksaw made it a dawdle for me, especially when it came to cutting the roofing sheets.

 

[Woodbloke]

It's one of those things you can do without but once you've got one you're constantly saying "how did I used to be able to work without this?" I don't use my Makita particularly often as I don't work with sheets on a regular basis and try to avoid work that involves sheets, but it's been very useful for a large number of jobs that would've been tricky otherwise.

I had a Festool track saw which was a complete waste of money for the sort of work I do, so I got rid of it. The thing was never used a great deal as I very, very rarely use sheet material and it just stat gathering dust - Rob

 

[Lons]

I have the Makita, not used a great deal as I don't cut up much in the way of sheet material however when I do it's perfect for the job. I cut up some long lengths of 30mm thick sapele a couple of weeks ago with it because it would have been akward on the table saw and it was simple and a better finish.

You don't need a diamond scoring blade either I just set blade at the preset 3mm cut, run it down the track, reset it to correct depth and cut through, takes seconds to adjust and good finish both sides.
I could buy 2 Makitas or several Aldi models for the price of that.

 

[SamQ aka Ah! Q!]

You don't need a diamond scoring blade either I just set blade at the preset 3mm cut, run it down the track, reset it to correct depth and cut through, takes seconds to adjust and good finish both sides.

Years ago, I worked with the best (technical) photographer I ever knew, Lennie Callan. He had one Rollieflex for everything, saying:

"It ain't what you got, it's how you uses it!".

The above tip epitomises Len's philosophy to a tee.

 

[AJB Temple]

I was in Aldilidl the other day and they had their 240v tracksaw in stock. I think it was £49 including a piece of track. I've never used one, and clearly PRC made, but undeniably cheap.

To put this in context a typical TCT general use branded blade for a Mafell is £55 ish. About the same for Hilti. Not sure but I think Mafell blades may be manufactured by Swedex. I have a few for different things and they come back from the sharpeners good as new as the TCT is generous.

The Hilti looks similar to the Mafell (which has a cheaper Bosch clone, but crucially the Bosch does not have the heavy duty industrial motor).

I don't know about the Lidlald saws or Makita for that matter, but some have a thumb lever you press to do the score cut, skim along and press same lever again to do the cut. Super easy and instant. Capacity seems to vary quite a bit between track saws. The MT55 is 57mm as is the Hilti, which is idea for fitters as the 45 degree angle is 40.5mm and so will do a thick kitchen top without bogging down. Each to their own. Mine has paid for itself and I would buy another.

 

[Doug]

You don't need a diamond scoring blade either I just set blade at the preset 3mm cut, run it down the track, reset it to correct depth and cut through, takes seconds to adjust and good finish both sides.
I could buy 2 Makitas or several Aldi models for the price of that.

But are you getting a chip free cut on the board that hasn’t got the track on it Bob? I’ve certainly never got a chip free surface on the non track side of the cut even cutting as you suggest?

 

[Lons]

You don't need a diamond scoring blade either I just set blade at the preset 3mm cut, run it down the track, reset it to correct depth and cut through, takes seconds to adjust and good finish both sides.
I could buy 2 Makitas or several Aldi models for the price of that.

But are you getting a chip free cut on the board that hasn’t got the track on it Bob? I’ve certainly never got a chip free surface on the non track side of the cut even cutting as you suggest?

Yes I do Doug, clean cut both sides even on faced chipboard which I use for cupboards.
I've had the saw a few years, still original unsharpened blade though it's been occasional use not heavy. I have cut some difficult timber with it and even a couple of lengths of 25mm solid surface worktops.

You know what's going to happen now I've said that don't you as I've probably put the mockers on it. :shock:

I haven't used the Aldi saw but my brother has had one for a while and is happy enough and there are a number of UKW members who used to swear by them. With a 3 year warranty, track interchangable with some of the big brands and such a low price there seems to be little to lose.

 

[meccarroll]

You don't need a diamond scoring blade either I just set blade at the preset 3mm cut, run it down the track, reset it to correct depth and cut through, takes seconds to adjust and good finish both sides.
I could buy 2 Makitas or several Aldi models for the price of that.

But are you getting a chip free cut on the board that hasn’t got the track on it Bob? I’ve certainly never got a chip free surface on the non track side of the cut even cutting as you suggest?

That's a good point which could get lost in the conversation had you not highlighted it Doug. :text-bravo:

I'm not trying to taking sides either way as I don't use a plunge saw but they certainly seem handy for the right type of work.

 

[AJB Temple]

BTW I wasn't aiming to start a plunge saw debate. Just pointing out that Hilti are in the game now.

If I had a big workshop with a nice sliding table saw and assembly area I may well never have bought one. But for handling sheet materials I wouldn't be without some kind of plunge saw now. I think half the battle is a really rigid track jointing system and fresh strips as needed.

 

[SamQ aka Ah! Q!]

Doug asked:

But are you getting a chip free cut on the board that hasn’t got the track on it Bob? I’ve certainly never got a chip free surface on the non track side of the cut even cutting as you suggest?

I'd concur with Bob - and others. I use a sacrificial sheet underneath; some ancient blockboard that I had no other use for = clean cuts. A Hugetoober I spotted uses a sheet of high density insulation foam on the floor for the same reason. Peter Millard uses a derivation of this in his MFT videos, where he uses a replaceable MDF insert under the track edge. I also seem to recall P.M. did a comparative video early on in his Tube history, comparing cut finish with various methods, can't recall the title.

Sam

P.S. I use a Sheppach (cheap!) and, apart from the strip throwing itself off the track because of glue with the qualities of spit, no problems. One of the German lads, Cosmas Bauer, has a video on improving his. He includes a less pugilative spring and closing off dust ejection.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vqqcmC5UY5E

And,

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQcROnDi1HY

 

[Jonathan]

I believe these cheap track saws are absolutely fine for the odd cut here and there. But for professional use they don't stand up to continuous day in day out use. This is where Hilti, Festool and Mafel are in a league of there own.
Adrian, I have the new style festool track jointing strips and they are great, these are what I use to do site work.
In the workshop I have a homemade 2.4m MDF Track that's my go to.

Sent from my Redmi Note 9S using Tapatalk

 

[SamQ aka Ah! Q!]

Couldn't agree more Jonathan. I don't earn my living via the Sheppach, so for my amateur use, it's fine.

 

[AJB Temple]

Hi Jonathan. I've not got much experience with the Festool track saws, though the latest one seems a leap forward, but when I was looking several years ago people moaned a bit about joint accuracy when pinning two tracks together, which is obviously needed a lot for full sheets. The Mafell method has a rigid sliding steel thing with 4 slot tighteners that work well. I actually have three tracks so when cutting up sheets I can do long and cross without messing around. I very rarely clamp the tracks. Also recently added a short track for fiddly bits.

I find with sacrificial sheets that they work great if they are rigid enough on my trestles (usually use 4 by 2 stretchers to help + double the underboards up). But what is irritating is that even with the smooth type of Festool extraction hose, it tends to catch on the snagged up board. If I was in a proper workshop I would use an overhead hose hook, but working in rooms I am fitting out, that is too much bother.

 

[Lons]

The Aldi/Lidl (Parkside) track is apparently interchangeble with Festool as I believe is my Makita little difference apart from price I believe which is significant. I seriously considered buying an Aldi saw a while ago as the whole system was cheaper than one length of extra track at that time.

 

[Woolf]

But what is irritating is that even with the smooth type of Festool extraction hose, it tends to catch on the snagged up board. If I was in a proper workshop I would use an overhead hose hook, but working in rooms I am fitting out, that is too much bother.

Would this help?

https://www.festool.co.za/accessory/gui ... ---fs2-aw#Übersicht

 

[AJB Temple]

Thanks. I've not seen those. My rails are Mafell profile. But in any case, I doubt that would work with the way I work. I prefer to have the hose over to one side, not dragging over the end of the rail. This is because 90% of the time I don't clamp the rail. The rubber base stops it moving anyway as long as a little pressure is applied, but a vac hose dragging over the end is bound to move the rail. But it has made me think about making a hose / cable slider that I could clamp to the table, so thank you.