Advice on ELU 1251

[Ruth]

Hi being new to the forum I am not sure if I am posting this in right place,but here goes, I have an ELU 1251 been using it a few weeks no problem,but last week starting using it and within minutes it just stopped an wont start,I have checked the fuse an it was fine,I cant find a restart button,I am not as you may have guessed an expert but really want this machine to start again .hope someone can tell me if there is a restart button an if so where to find it,tried to send PM to a recommended Gent who may have the answer but cant seem to PM ,so posting here,
Cheers

 

[AndyP]

I am sure Bob, 9fingers, is the gent to whom you refer. I am sure he will be along shortly.

 

[misterfish]

The ELU 1251 later became the Dewalt 1251. One of its problems can be the spring loaded on/off switch in the handle - mine failed a while ago afer a short period of being intermittant. You can usually get spares on Ebay for just over £30.

I'd recommend waiting for Bob (9fingers) who will be able to give you useful advice on how to test and diagnose the fault on your machine.

Jeff

 

[9fingers]

+1 for Jeff's comment.

The switch are possibly the most unreliable component in the whole range.

If when you switch on absolutely nothing happens then I would suspect the switch.
Test by bypassing the switch before buying a new one.
If however there is a buzzing from the motor but it does not turn, then that is a capacitor failure.
I'm not sure where it is located (Jeff will know). My saw is 3 phase and so does not need a starting capacitor, Jeff has a single phase machine from memory.

Come back if you need more help.

HTH

Bob

 

[Ruth]

Hi Thank you all for the advice,
9 fingers or Bob it is you who I was advised to seek an ask about the ELU by a helpful chap Mailee ,
machine doesn't make any noise at all ,as if no power is going to it,when unplugged blade i tried see if blade still turns ok an it did,
Hopefully Jeff can help as you say
Cheers

 

[9fingers]

Ruth,

You have proved that it is not the capacitor so with the known weakness of the switch, plus your symptoms,
I think the switch needs looking at. I believe there may be two types. One is a simple switch - two pole on off, the other which I *think* was fitted to later machines, has a no volt release function.

Best thing will be to release the switch from the housing whilst keeping all the wires attached, firstly check that none have fallen off, and then take a photo of the switch mechanism and post it here or send it to me
Motors@minchin.org.uk and I'll post it here and try and suggest the next steps.

HTH

Bob

 

[mailee]

Yes it was I Sir, guilty as charged. :lol: I hope you didn't mind Bob but all I could do was send a copy of the manual.

 

[9fingers]

Yes it was I Sir, guilty as charged. :lol: I hope you didn't mind Bob but all I could do was send a copy of the manual.

No problem Alan. I need a few little puzzles every now and then to keep my motor brain active :lol:

Bob

 

[misterfish]

My early 1251 is single phase as Bob says. The switch on mine was spring loaded designed so that it had to be held in all the time the saw was working - it did have (what I believe to be) a thermal overload circuit. When my switch died I couldn't find a suitable replacement and ended up with a NVR switch at knee height so that I can switch it off with my knee if need be.

I'd suggest opening upthe handle and looking at the switch and then if it looks the same then buy one from Ebay and swap it (making a note of which of the spade connectors goes where.

Jeff

 

[Ruth]

Thank you for advice ,very helpful,
Hi Alan thanks for directing me here,
I will go look see if I can take switch cover off an have a nose in there,
there are 2 buttons that turn on an off they are next to each other and when it was switched on I didn't have to keep it pressed in,I have other machines here an not a clue how to use them,but hopefully will get some knowledge from you guys,
will be back when I look at the switch if I can work it out ,
Cheers peeps

 

[9fingers]

Ruth,

Your mention of two buttons, seems to indicate you have an early type 1 machine
see here for exploded diagrams and parts lists
http://www.mtmc.co.uk/Elu-Spare-Parts/E ... 34077.aspx

The first two links are possibly for your machine. This is not a variant I've seen before but separate stop and start switches sounds like there is some form of no volt release elsewhere controlled by those switches.

This could well be the item no 114 on the diagram and no longer available but do not despair - there will be ways of getting it running!

For comparison, look at the type two diagram for the more normal rocker type switch as also sold on ebay and referred to by both Jeff and I.

If you could edit your profile to indicate roughly where you are located, then maybe a more local member could offer direct help either on this or other subjects?

Bob

 

[Ruth]

Thank's Bob

This is not a variant I've seen before but separate stop and start switches sounds like there is some form of no volt release elsewhere controlled by those switches.

Forgive my ignorance Bob :? does this mean a sort of trip switch??
I am wondering has it cut out because I used it to cut wood strips that was not too thick,as it was first time I used it to cut that size wood,I use it to cut long 2x2ins wood for fire an done bags of it weeks ago not a problem ,but the first time used it for thinner wood machine turned off after few minutes :?
btw put location on profile ..good idea
will take pics when I find camera or even better usb lead
Cheers

 

[9fingers]

Forgive my ignorance Bob :? does this mean a sort of trip switch??

Not necessarily.

A no volt release is designed to prevent the saw re-starting if you are using it when the power fails and then comes back on. Sometimes an NVR switch also has a current sensing overload switch included.

When you get your camera out, please try and find the box marked 114 and open that up and take some pics of what it in there as well as the on/off switch.
If that box does include an overload trip, there will be a reset button in a readily available position.

Thinking ahead a bit. do you have any sort of multimeter for some electrical tests (or know someone who has) ?

Bob

 

[Ruth]

Sorry Bob been busy with goats kidding an doin pens up for them,managed to get some pics,will email them to you cant seem to do it here,an dont know how to use dropbox,will email now,
cheers
Ruth

 

[9fingers]

Hi Ruth,

No worries about the delay but could you answer the last question in my last post about multimeter please?

OK I will host your photo on my photobucket account but for the future I suggested you get a photobucket account in your own name. It is free, tolerably easy to use and works well with out forum software, there are others avialable as they say but certainly Dropbox is the pits when it comes to working with the forum software and we don't know why so we just suggest leaving it alone.

There is a tutorial for post photos in the forum here when the time comes http://www.thewoodhaven2.co.uk/viewtopic.php?f=20&t=64


Here are your photos













So where is this located? Do you think it might be the mystery part 141 in the parts diagrams?

If so then is the thing in the middle some sort of switch or rest button?
Where does the wire go that we see top centre. It is the incoming power or is it going off to the motor. does it have other wires going to it?

Can you open it up and get some inside photos please. If when you take your photos, you do one of the subject in perspective to the rest of the machine and then a close up to show whatever detail you are wanted to communicate.


This final photo is interesting



Firstly the big white cylinder is the capacitor and does not look swollen or discoloured which is good.

The back of the stop and start button should each have two connections, but I don't see any wires on the bottom left one (start?) hopefully the wires from those buttons will go off to the magic 141 box?

If so I'm starting to get an idea for the layout which I'll need you to confirm

One mains input going to box 141, one or maybe two going off to the handle and one leaving the handle to got to the motor?

Am I getting warm?

If not can you describe it accurately back to me in a similar manner please.

Good luck with the kids!

Bob

 

[Ruth]

Wow Bob and interested peeps

I went with pen an paper an camera to the the ELU an started following the wires you asked me to check Bob ,
writing down route of the wires to black 141 box (top wire sticking out of black box went to power supply).

The wires from stop an start buttons....the left button that looked like it had no wires connected,had a black wire looped to start button it was underneath start wires out of sight and the black wire then went to motor.

The wires from right side start button went along arm an back of stand for arm an in side of black box ,

The black box was situated at back under in a cut out of the worktop,if you look pic 4 an see a can of WD40 well the black box at back next to arm stand,you can just see wires coming from top of a cut out

what looked like a switch in front of the black box was fixed ,(maybe used to be a reset switch )cos someone had been in that box screws was odd on each side not same type.

To take pic for you showing wires going into side of black box,I scrambled on to floor under bench an low an behold :shock: .........was a very small red button right underneath the 141 black box..

Guess what ...I pressed it in plugged machine in an it started !!! it was like music to my ears when it started,

So happy ,Thank you so much Bob an other contributors to this post an big thank you to Alan for directing me to Bob who guided me through the wiring,U Bob are so clever an I cant thank you enough,you know your stuff ,Prepare to hear from me shout for help when I start using the other machines ,when I figure out what they do that is
once again BIG THANKS :eusa-clap: an Bless your cotton socks
Ruth
ps I don't have multi meter .but I do have an ELU 1251 waiting for me,I am off to cut wood peeps !!

 

[9fingers]

Excellent News Ruth!

You can fast forward past the need for a multimeter and go straight to wood cutting now!

Glad to have been able to help and feel free to ask in future if you need more help.

Cheers

Bob

PS don't forget to get your partner interested in your woodwork too!