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Router advice please - Festool?

AJB Temple

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Adrian
After struggling with an oak worktop sink cut out, I think it is finally time for me to get another router for more accurate work. My main tool is a very powerful 1/2" Hitachi, which is old (I got it second hand) and seen a lot of use, mainly hogging out hundreds of mortices on oak, rounding off thousands of feet of corners and jobs like that. However, it is now feeling worn and has very awkward tool change, no dust extraction, hopeless depth control, worn springs, no light, no useful guards, and no fence. I also have a Trend 1/2" that lives in my router table and I won't be buying another Trend.:rolleyes: I have 1/4" too (Elu and some AEG and Stanley trimmer, but 90% of my bits are Wealdon or Trend 1/2". I'm not a router expert at all.

Please make some recommendations based on experience. We will probably buy second hand if it is a pricey machine, and have looked at Festool online but not sure I understand the range pros and cons. For example, is the side handle that some have good, or a pain? What features are good?

Must haves: soft start / dust extraction / precise and easy to set depth control / easy bit change / 240v or battery (not 110v)

Nice to haves: a light illuminating the cut / guard against bit or work fragmentation / rapid stop brake / speed control

Thanks. A
 
I'm happy with my Triton TRA01. I got it mainly for the depth control, but have it set up in my Veritas router table. However, I am only an occasional user, so can't comment on its longevity with frequent use.
 
I am a fan of spending only what you need but am increasingly realising why some kit costs more and feel that it can be worth spending more when the experience is made more pleasurable - I have just upgraded some tools to Festool… Don’t use my various routers enough to upgrade but having used the Festool one I would have little hesitation…
 
Thanks. But which Festool one?
I will be honest - not looked at them in detail and I guess it depends more on how you use it - my current modus operandi seems to be to buy several models if they have different advantages so I am not sure that I am a good influence!
 
I have the Festool OF1400 and really like it, it's actually my only router and has been used for everything from fitting worktops and routing out stair strings to cutting out for small cabinet hinges. Like all Festool tools it's user friendly and top quality which makes it a pleasure to use. The side handle is a bit Marmite but to me it feels totally natural and find myself often using it one handed while holding the work piece with the other.

If you were to be using it for cutting out Oak worktops all day the OF2200 would be a better choice but for an all rounder the OF1400 is great (if you get on with the handles).
 
Like Doug I’ve got the 1400 and whilst it doesn’t get masses of use (triton in the table) it is an easy to use, well made tool. I find the handles comfortable and well positioned for me.

If I had to buy again I would.
 
I have the OF 1010 EQB-Plus. It is 1/4" and 8mm I think. Probably too small for your needs but easy to use. despite or because of the handles? I also have a TRA001 the model before they brought out the adjustment from below. I bought it in a B&Q sale reduced from £254.00 to £98.98. The TRA took a little getting used to after the ELU but was easier to use once used to it. The speed control /soft start on my ELU MOF 96 02 type 2 had gone and the TRA001 was only slightly more expensive than the replacement controller at the time. I still have the MOF but it gives a good kick on startup.

Of them all the Festool is the easiest to use and has good dust control. At the moment I use them very little and should really get rid of one or two. I forgot I also have a 1/2" B&Q P Pro in the router table and it has been many years since i used that.
 
I will first say that I don't do a lot of work with a 1/2" router like some people do so they would have better experience and opinions than myself.

I really like my Makita RP2301FCX, it's got plenty of power, the linear ball-bearing slides make plunging smooth and effortless, the LED light makes seeing what you're doing much easier, and the fence is very high quality and super solid unlike many other machines where this is often the letdown. They seem to have come out with a new model now the RP2303 and the fence on that looks like it's been downgraded from the high quality one which is a shame.

1712483450772.jpeg

Here's a secondhand one in what looks to be excellent condition, £150-200 seems to be about the going rate for a decent secondhand one on eBay so they're obviously quite sought after.

https://cashgenerator.co.uk/product...-router-1-2-240-volt-with-original-carry-case
 
Must haves: soft start / dust extraction / precise and easy to set depth control / easy bit change / 240v or battery (not 110v)

Nice to haves: a light illuminating the cut / guard against bit or work fragmentation / rapid stop brake / speed control

I migrated from Bosch, Triton, and two others that I can't remember, to Festool. I now have the OF2200, OF1400, OF1010, and MFK700 for handheld routers and the AUKTools MK2 motor in my router table. I also have a spindle moulder (shaper for us Yanks) for a planned project.

I don't think there is a one size fits all for handheld routers, but the OF1400 would be my choice if I could only have one router. It will accept the 1/4", 1/2", 8mm, and 12mm collets without being a beast to handle and works seamlessly with the rest of the Festool accessories. Aside from battery power and illumination, it ticks all of the "must have" and "nice to have" boxes you identified. Festool offers a LED module for the newer models of the OF1010, but nothing so far for the rest of the product line. However, there are several third-party options for the OF1400.

In terms of the "must haves", dust collection was the primary factor for my decision. The Bosch GOF1600CE, with the plunge and fixed base, was a good router but not an indoor tool. Dust collection was horrible, despite having a powerful shop vac connected to it. The Triton TRA001 was just as bad.

The next on the "must have" list was variable speed so I could use large cutters without undue risk of damaging them (or me). Both the Bosch and Triton have variable speed, but the two routers I have forgotten about did not, nor did they have soft start. Working with a large cutter in those machines was not enjoyable.

Battery power is not a factor for me, as I am now working primarily in my basement shop and have plenty of 230V and 400V distribution.
 
"really like my Makita RP2301FCX"

Seconded Dan. Mine is smoother than my DW625 in both sound and action. I know Custard (I.I R.C.) was suspicious of a slight 'rock' in plunging, because of the bearings' tolerances, but in practice, great bit of kit. I especially like the light.
 
Thanks. But which Festool one?
I thought I'd leave your enquiry for a while before chipping in my 2 euros. I bought the Festool OF1400 some years ago and it's proved to be a beautiful bit of kit. I view it as mid way 'twixt a small 1/4" sized router and a really big n'heavy 1/2" one, but with a swift change collets it'll take 1/4", 1/2" and 8mm shanks; the plunge mechanism is also really, really smooth compared to the somewhat 'snatchy' effect on my small DeWalt router; in many ways I wish I'd splurged out the extra spondulicos and bought the small Festool. In my very 'umble opinion, if you want to purchase the best router out there that'll do everything you need it to do, look no further than the OF1400 - Rob

Edit - handles are nae bother now I've got used to them, but they were a bit strange at first.
 
I know Custard (I.I R.C.) was suspicious of a slight 'rock' in plunging, because of the bearings' tolerances, but in practice, great bit of kit. I especially like the light.

There is a very slight ‘rock’ but you do have to purposely skew it on one side to make it do that and it’s not very much, I’ve never had an issue because of it anyway but maybe someone that is working to such tight tolerances like Custard might notice problems.

It’s a similar discussion to some people have about metal lathes and single versus three phase motors and that a three phase motor runs smoother and thus you produce much smoother parts... take the anorak off, the sun is shining!
 
Thank you everyone, inc Doug, Mike in Germany and Rob. Just got back after a day shopping with my wife (first time in ages) and really appreciate the replies. Clearly I need to go for an OF1400 based on advice, so I will do exactly that.
 
Sorry slightly late to the party. I went from a performance power 1/2” router to a Festool OF1400. The Festool is lovely to use, being able to consistently adjust 0.1mm at a time and with good dust extraction it is a pleasure to use now I have got over how much it cost to buy. I would not hesitate in buying one again.

I also have a Katsu 1/4” trimmer and an AUK motor in the router table which do different jobs.
 
Thank you. There are actually quite a few on eBay and although I said not 110v they are much cheaper and I do have a multi outlet 110v transformer in the workshop. Might buy a 240v new and be done with. A critical part of the decision for me is dust extraction. None of the routers I have now: Hitatchi (worn) Trend (in table), Elu (v old), Stanley (screw base trimmer), and pretty old AEG have any kind of useful dust extraction. I like Festool gear so that will be perfect I think, although I also intend to have a look at the Mafell LO65, which gets good reviews, but is more similar to the bigger festool. If I do that I will sell all the others and buy a battery trim router as well for round overs etc.
 
have you tried changing the bit? I'd at least try a wealden tool bit, they are in a different league to trend bits.
 
Hi. Yes, thanks very much but it was a Wealden bit fitted and I think that one was unused. They are just down the road from us as it happens (which I was unaware of until Mike G told me) and I agree with you much more reliable than Trend. The bit quality was not the issue - the main problem with the router was not being able to get the depth with my home made template on, and not being able to use a guide bush on this tool.
 
Were you using a bushing or a bearing? With a bearing, if you can’t get the depth with the template on. Can you cut to max depth with the template. Then remove the template and run the bearing along the surface you have just cut? Apologies if you already knew that.
 
No, as noted in the post above, I was not able to fit a bushing to the big Hitachi. Without that I needed a top bearing bit, which I didn't have. The bottom bearing was no use as it would just follow the contour of a rough cut from the jigsaw. Thought I might get round that by fitting a bottom template but gave up as I could not be certain of accuracy. Hence adopted a different method this time as I really needed to get it done. Used the router to clean up the corners and had depth issues. It's fine - this was a heavy duty machine that I bought s/h ages ago specifically for timber framing work. I never intended it to do this kind of work, but it would be handy to have a machine that has dust collection and much finer depth control.
 
The OF1400 accepts what Festool calls "copy rings", which snap into the base and serve as the guide bushes. There are seven sizes for the OF1400 with outer diameters ranging from 8.5mm to 40mm. Unlike the OF1010, the plates are not adjustable and rely on the accuracy of the machine to ensure the center of the bush aligns with the center of the cutter. The OF2200 has a similar fixed copy ring setup that sandwiched between the base and the bottom of the machine. I have not observed any problems yet with the alignment on the OF1400 or OF2200, but was surprised that there is no means for adjustment. The plates for the OF1010 are attached to the base with two screws, and the mounting holes in the plate are large enough to allow a little lateral movement.

Festool offers a guide bushing adapter for the OF1400, part number ‎493566, that accepts the Porter Cable and Whiteside style of guides. I have this plate for use with my Leigh D4R jig, but do not have the PC or Whiteside guides (yet). The Leigh guide fits perfectly in the bushing adapter with no lateral movement. The cost of the adapter and a set of brass PC-style bushes is about the same cost of two of the Festool copy rings.
 
Thought I should mention, Adrian, that both Festool and Makita make inexpensive slider accessories ("router guide rail adaptor") to use their routers with plunge saw guide rails.

I don't know detail about the Festool one (Peter Millard uses it occasionally), but the Makita one has standard-spaced clamps for router fence bars, so a variety of routers will fit on it:

Fence bars? I mean the pair that usually clamp just above the router's base plate to hold its fence when you're routing, say, along the edge of a board. There are two common spacings and bar diameters. All you do is unscrew the actual fence and use the pair of bars to connect the router's baseplate to the slider (it slides clear of the actual saw rail).

This isn't a disguised advert: I haven't bought one (yet), but if I did, it would fit my Trend T11, Bosch POF600A, and presumably also Makita. It's likely to also fit Festool routers (but they have their own slider accessory, at a price, anyway).
 
Thanks Mike & Eric. That is super helpful. All of my tracks are Mafell (same as Bosch). I will have to check what actually fits before I buy. Might have to visit Axminster near me if it is still there.

As an aside re Trend T11, I bought mine to fit upside down in a router table. I'm now on my third one, the first two have both been replaced under warranty: one failed due to defunct on/off switch. That one they took back for repair and was returned not working at all. They swapped that for a new one which lasted three months before the speed control unit failed, as well as it vibrating quite a bit. The third one has been OK but this experience put me off. It's nowhere near as powerful in use as the Hitachi - you can really tell in hard oak cleaning out deep mortices.
 
PPS: I was going to get a spindle at one point, and even sourced one through FIL. Dan helped me a lot, but I bottled out in the end as I find them scary and would not use it enough. Would not have helped on this job anyway.
 
PPS: I was going to get a spindle at one point, and even sourced one through FIL. Dan helped me a lot, but I bottled out in the end as I find them scary and would not use it enough. Would not have helped on this job anyway.
If you change your mind about the spindle moulder, there is a guy about two hours north of me who rebuilds the full line of early Elektra Beckum machines. I bought this TF-904 kit shown below, excluding the Robart power feeder, for €1,900 and it includes a two-year warranty. This machine was built in 1995, but it looks like it could have come off the display floor yesterday.

My wife was looking over my shoulder while I was watching a video about installing skirting and crown moulding, and said we must have this in our house. The tile skirting in the image below is what is throughout the house and is the German way. I told her I would love to install custom skirting, but I don't have any way to make it. She reminded me that every new project is an opportunity to buy a new tool.

TF-904-Complete-3.jpg

Since I can't leave well enough alone, I replaced the bottom section with a two-drawer cabinet on locking rollers for tools, cutters, and cable storage. I might have to add a second dust extraction port to the side of the upper cabinet, but so far there hasn't been any chip accumulation to mingle with the drive belt and pulleys. I also added two 3-phase power connectors, one for the input cable and one for the power feeder cable.

TF-904-Base-5a.jpg
 
Mike, I have said this before to you, and clearly need to say it again. It is a workshop, not an operating theatre. That is military spick and span clean. ;)

The inlaws and my wife's place in Germany all have tile or stone skirting as well. The stairs are all stone too. Stud walls were a no no when my FIL built the houses: everything is built solidly. Which makes it really difficult to alter now....

The spindle was for much the same reason as you: I wanted to run off a lot of skirting, T&G some boards and make a lot of panelling. I've nearly done it all now so the need has fallen away.
 
Mike, I have said this before to you, and clearly need to say it again. It is a workshop, not an operating theatre. That is military spick and span clean. ;)

The military is to blame. The last task of every shop day is to clean and put away any stray tools. I usually put tools away immediately and clean as I go, but sometimes I might accidentally leave a tool on the bench when I'm not using it. A lifetime of conditioning is difficult to change. :)

The inlaws and my wife's place in Germany all have tile or stone skirting as well. The stairs are all stone too. Stud walls were a no no when my FIL built the houses: everything is built solidly. Which makes it really difficult to alter now....

The walls and floors in my house are cast in place reinforced concrete, but the stairs are wooden (and very sturdy). The original owner took hundreds of photos while the house was being built, and gave me two CDs with the images. These came in very handy as I was trying to trace the electrical and plumbing distribution. Hanging pictures, bookshelves, or anything else to the walls requires the Bosch D-tect 150 to locate the rebar and the SDS hammer drill.
 
Mike, I have said this before to you, and clearly need to say it again. It is a workshop, not an operating theatre. That is military spick and span clean. ;)
I had it on very good authortity from my pal Mike Huntley, one time ex-editor of F&C (when it was a decent mag) that Robert Ingham had a very Japanese approach to his vast workshop. At the threshold, all who entered were required to take off their outside shoes and replace them with soft carpet slippers, a selection of which were lined up outside the door. Absolutely true - Rob
 
I had it on very good authortity from my pal Mike Huntley, one time ex-editor of F&C (when it was a decent mag) that Robert Ingham had a very Japanese approach to his vast workshop. At the threshold, all who entered were required to take off their outside shoes and replace them with soft carpet slippers, a selection of which were lined up outside the door. Absolutely true - Rob
I hope they steel toecaps.
S
 
The best meaty router I ever had was an original MOF177e. It got nicked and I still miss it. I have the Festool 1010 and the 1400. Both excellent but I prefer the "ear"-style handles of the older machines. I've also handled the massive Festool (2200? - I can't remember). Far too unwieldy and a group of us, all experienced woodie journos, had a go with it. I was the only person who didn't tip it over and spoil the cut, and I really struggled to avoid that outcome (and after seeing several others fail miserably, so I had a bit of a warning).
S


PS I really like this nice, clear, new format. Even I can read it with ease. Good job.
 
I hate doing this, but the Festool OF 1400 is now dead to me (at least for one purpose) and I was almost ready to send it to the bottom of the Rhine River to swim with the fish. I spent two days off and on trying to dial in the cutter depth for my current project using the Leigh D4R Pro dovetail jig and the OF 1400.

For those who have never used a Leigh dovetail jig, they are great for production work once dialed in. The YouTube videos make it look easy, but I was struggling with it and could have hand cut the dovetails in a small fraction of the time I spent on the Leigh jig.

Cutting half blind dovetails uses only one cutter and the depth is the same for the pin and tail boards. The art of setting it up is finding the sweet spot where the joint is tight. Leigh has a recommended depth of cut for each of the four cutters used for half blind dovetails, and the cutter choice depends on the thickness of the pin board. Small adjustments are made in the cutter projection to compensate for loose or tight joints.

In my case, the pin and tail boards are both 18mm, but they can be different thicknesses. The router must be fitted with the 7/16-inch outer diameter guide bushing. The OF 1400 (and OF 2200) use a snap-in bushing plates and are supposed to be factory set so the center of the bushing guide is over the center of the arbor. This sounds great, if it works, but there is no way for the user to adjust the guide bushing using a centering mandrel.

I started with the recommended depth of cut of 13mm for the router bit I was using, and cut a pin and tail board using some offcuts I saved from the milling process. This produced a joint that was too loose with a 1.5mm gap in the joint. I did not expect such a large gap, but followed the directions and extended the bit by the correct amount to close up the gaps. I made a second set of cuts on a fresh edge of the offcuts. These were also too loose by about the same amount as the first set of cuts and I was nearly at the point of no longer having a half blind dovetail.

Since I didn't want to use up my precious walnut offcuts, I milled a four-foot length of 3/4-inch thick poplar to 18mm thick. Then I cut it in half lengthwise so I had a practice pin and tail board. No matter what changes I made to the cutter depth, I could not reduce the gaps in the joint. After each failed attempt, I cut off the pins and tails so I had a fresh edge for the next attempt. I divided my time to reading the well-written manual for the Leigh jig (it really is well-written) and watching lots of YouTube videos to see where I was failing. I was doing everything correct, yet the joints would not close up. To make matters worse, most of the workers in the videos were using the OF 1400.

Near the end of the second day, after checking the water level of the river, I decided to reset everything to the Leigh recommendations and make another trial run. That is where I noticed the problem. The snap-in guide bushing adapter plate in the OF 1400 was moving side to side as I moved the router through the guide fingers of the jig. I unplugged the router, turned it upside down on the workbench, and gave the adapter plate a wiggle. Sure enough, there was movement of the plate in the base of the router. This is why the joints were always loose no matter what I did with the router bit depth.

After a lot of research on the Internet, I discovered this is a well-documented failing of both the OF 1400 and the OF 2200. This problem does not exist with the OF 1010 because the guide bushings are attached to the base by screws and the mounting holes are large enough to allow for adjustment when used with a centering mandrel.

To demonstrate the movement, here is a very short YouTube video from ten years ago showing the amount of movement of the guide bushing adapter plate on the OF 1400. This is not my video, but my OF 1400 has the same amount of movement.


Unfortunately, there is nothing that can be done to fix this and Festool appears to ignore the issue.

I didn't have the adapter plate for my OF 1010, so I ordered two and waited. With shipping from Austria, the total cost was about €20. When they arrived two days later, I attached the 7/16-inch guide bushing to one of the plates, centered the bushing to the arbor, set the depth of cut to 13mm, and made another test run. I think I heard angels singing in the background. The fit was almost perfect, but there was a 0.4mm gap in the joint (I used a feeler gauge to check). I made a 0.4mm adjustment to the cutting depth and made another test cut on fresh edges of the boards. It was a perfect fit. I made two more sets of joints to make sure the second test cut was not a fluke, and they were identical. Success! The total time with the OF 1010 to complete the trial runs and make two proof of concept runs was about 30 minutes. I spent the better part of two days chasing shadows with the OF 1400.

Bottom line: I did not know of this issue when I recommended the OF 1400, else I would have certainly mentioned it. I had never used the guide bushings with the OF 1400 until I bought the Leigh jig. If you need to make precise cuts using guide bushings, the OF 1400 or OF 2200 are NOT recommended, as they are not fit for purpose in this operation. Otherwise, they are great routers for use with fence guides or guide rails, or bearing guided cutters, but don't rely on them when using guide bushings.
 
That's not what you want with a guide bush at all!

My Makita has a very simple clip-in system which seems very solid and accurate, I've certainly not noticed any discernable play in the bushes when they're in the holder but I've not been working to such tight tolerances as dovetails when I've been using bushes with it.
 
I will first say that I don't do a lot of work with a 1/2" router like some people do so they would have better experience and opinions than myself.

I really like my Makita RP2301FCX, it's got plenty of power, the linear ball-bearing slides make plunging smooth and effortless, the LED light makes seeing what you're doing much easier, and the fence is very high quality and super solid unlike many other machines where this is often the letdown. They seem to have come out with a new model now the RP2303 and the fence on that looks like it's been downgraded from the high quality one which is a shame.

View attachment 25701

Here's a secondhand one in what looks to be excellent condition, £150-200 seems to be about the going rate for a decent secondhand one on eBay so they're obviously quite sought after.

https://cashgenerator.co.uk/product...-router-1-2-240-volt-with-original-carry-case
I am about to sell a very similar Makita one - hardly used, if you are at all interested pls PM me Adrian.
I bought it to use with a special bush on for my Leigh Dovetail jig, also selling soon.
Ian
Ps, what a coincidence, I’ve just read the rest of this thread!
 
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The best meaty router I ever had was an original MOF177e. It got nicked and I still miss it. I have the Festool 1010 and the 1400. Both excellent but I prefer the "ear"-style handles of the older machines. I've also handled the massive Festool (2200? - I can't remember). Far too unwieldy and a group of us, all experienced woodie journos, had a go with it. I was the only person who didn't tip it over and spoil the cut, and I really struggled to avoid that outcome (and after seeing several others fail miserably, so I had a bit of a warning).
S


PS I really like this nice, clear, new format. Even I can read it with ease. Good job.
I had the same model Steve and sold it one day during a brain melt moment when a mate offered me stupid money for it. One of the biggest mistakes I ever made, the DeWalt I later replaced it with was nowhere near as good quality. I still have the little 96e which I wouldn't part with though.
 
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