• Hi all and welcome to TheWoodHaven2 brought into the 21st Century, kicking and screaming! We all have Alasdair to thank for the vast bulk of the heavy lifting to get us here, no more so than me because he's taken away a huge burden of responsibility from my shoulders and brought us to this new shiny home, with all your previous content (hopefully) still intact! Please peruse and feed back. There is still plenty to do, like changing the colour scheme, adding the banner graphic, tweaking the odd setting here and there so I have added a new thread in the 'Technical Issues, Bugs and Feature Requests' forum for you to add any issues you find, any missing settings or just anything you'd like to see added/removed from the feature set that Xenforo offers. We will get to everything over the coming weeks so please be patient, but add anything at all to the thread I mention above and we promise to get to them over the next few days/weeks/months. In the meantime, please enjoy!

Ian’s new workshop. The Wonky Donkey. Insulated side dooor.

C

Cabinetman

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Location
Lincolnshire Wolds + Massachusetts
Name
Ian
I’ve been pretty busy since my last mention of my new Workshop, I managed to find almost next door a supplier of secondhand insulation, it was about a quarter of the normal price and it allowed me to buy about 90 sheets of inch and a half Kingspan type stuff.
It was only after loading it I realise that I was itching and it had been up against fibreglass insulation at some point I hate that stuff and Pam is badly affected by it – lungwise, so it all has to be vacuumed, heyho.
Very few of the sheets had even a mark on them so pretty delighted.

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Good news! I have been applying for my Green card which I got approval for the other day – yippee! Quite a process I can tell you. But just a fortnight too late for me to go back to the UK with Pam for a wedding, so I am here on my own– you’re not allowed to leave whilst applying for the card.
But this does mean that I have 2 1/2 weeks on my Jack Jones with which to get on with my Workshop. I have started pulling down the old ceiling which was just at the wrong height and not very good really at all. The weather has been extremely hot and humid and I can’t believe all I’ve managed to get done in two and a half days is get to this point.
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Next I am fitting timbers to the L/H wall so that I have something to attach the Furring strips to- these are horizontal 1x3” strips which sit on top of all the insulation they do two jobs, holding the insulation to the wall and accepting the screws from the plasterboard etc.
 
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Yes thank you, it’s going to take me quite a while but I’ve gone through the exact build process in my mind lots of times so there shouldn’t be any nasty surprises, after that wall repair there is a bit of window work and then it’s buy in lots of 2x4’s and the ply for the floor.
Can’t wait!!
 
Looking at your ceiling ‘hanging’ board, have you got a board lifter? Or a couple of those small telescopic poles with a small pad on the top and a lever to raise it up to push the board up against the joists?
 
RogerS said:
Looking at your ceiling ‘hanging’ board, have you got a board lifter? Or a couple of those small telescopic poles with a small pad on the top and a lever to raise it up to push the board up against the joists?
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Even better thanks Roger, two strapping youngish guys to help, one SIL and his friend who is v keen on woodwork who wants to learn from an expert and nothing I can say will change his opinion of me lol.
 
Excellent Ian. There's a strong market in seconds of Celotex/ Kingspan insulation over here, too. They're generally seconds, rather than second-hand.
 
Mike G said:
Excellent Ian. There's a strong market in seconds of Celotex/ Kingspan insulation over here, too. They're generally seconds, rather than second-hand.
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Its a bit strange as its obviously been used as it’s dirty dusty and polluted with fibreglass bits but no fixing holes or expanding foam.
But certainly saved me a lot of money, it was $1200 for 90 sheets so about £10 each!
Question please @Mike G I shall be cutting some up to use two layers between the floor joists, and shall be sealing around the top edges of the top layer, but do I need to seal around the bottom one too before putting the top layer on?
Or do I glue the two layers together and just seal around the top edges? Thanks
 
The more you can do to reduce air-flow around and between the boards the better. However, I've never seen two layers joined together in any way. The danger in trying would be that you would force the boards apart with the adhesive, so unless you got 100% coverage you would be creating gaps. I suggest just selecting flat boards for the task, or boards that have compatible curves, and then fix them in place as tightly packed together as you can. Do as much edge-sealing as you can. That's the real weakness, normally.
 
Mike G said:
The more you can do to reduce air-flow around and between the boards the better. However, I've never seen two layers joined together in any way. The danger in trying would be that you would force the boards apart with the adhesive, so unless you got 100% coverage you would be creating gaps. I suggest just selecting flat boards for the task, or boards that have compatible curves, and then fix them in place as tightly packed together as you can. Do as much edge-sealing as you can. That's the real weakness, normally.
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Thanks, that makes sense. Luckily the boards are super flat, also just bought a proper foam gun which I’m expecting to be hugely better than the plastic hose on a can used before. We had new windows installed and I was watching them use one it did a brilliant job job.
 
fiveeyes said:
Ian..if you are doing two layers, run one horizontal, and the other vertical. Also, use foil tape on the joints.
Darn good price for that.

carry on
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Thanks, yes I had thought to alternate them, just because, well why not I suppose, but the tape, I intended to go down each joint between the sheets with expanding foam, in fact I was wondering whether or not to leave a couple mil gap to enable me to fill it? Or I suppose it’s just a whole lot easier to shove them up tight and tape?
The other thing is that these aren’t covered in foil like Kingspan they have a thick paper on both sides but I don’t know if that will make a difference or not.
Ian
 
duke said:
Ian can you find out the name of the product, ( sheet insulation ).
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It’s very boring! All it says is use this side for built up layers, I think that’s what it means, and a product code eg CHE053001
Ai thinks it could be from Chey insulation in New Hampshire which is fairly close? It’s a closed cell rigid foam board an inch and a half thick, fairly old by the looks of it. Sort of stuff supplied direct to the trade with no frills. The paper is a mid Grey colour, what we used to call sugar paper, quite thick- and cheap.
 
Cabinetman said:
Thanks, yes I had thought to alternate them, just because, well why not I suppose, but the tape, I intended to go down each joint between the sheets with expanding foam, in fact I was wondering whether or not to leave a couple mil gap to enable me to fill it? Or I suppose it’s just a whole lot easier to shove them up tight and tape?
The other thing is that these aren’t covered in foil like Kingspan they have a thick paper on both sides but I don’t know if that will make a difference or not.
Ian
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If you're going to foam, leave 5mm all round (ie subtract 10mm from each measurement). Wedge the sheet in place (you'll need 3 hands!). If you leave less than 5mm it's hard to get the nozzle in.
 
Big day today! Delivery of the first chunk of timber, next one will be the plasterboard if I go down that route, haven’t decided on that or the cladding for the front face with the door in it.
So today I took delivery of 10 sheets of very clean ply for the floor, 90 2x4’s for the sleeper floor and front wall, and 15 massive joists to span the ceiling. I’m probably going to put the chip extractor up there.
I was expecting the timber prices to go up with the Tariff shenanigans but if anything they’ve gone down. An 8’ of 2x4 cost $2.83 - about £2.10, begin to see why they build houses out of them.
The plywood is mainly stood up to get a couple of coats of water based poly floor varnish before I stand all over it and get it grubby, I do so like a nice looking floor in a workshop.
Anyway that’s me done for the day, a cold beer and a Barby beckon.

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Great stuff Ian. (y)

Wedding or workshop, what a choice to make. How much did you pay them to delay your green card. :ROFLMAO:
 
duke said:
Nice lumber, ahh Miller time.
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Well I can see where you’re coming from but the closest thing I’ve found in a can that resembles uk Bitter is Yingling lager. Absolutely nothing like a lager, but then most American beer is pretty weird.
Lons said:
Great stuff Ian. (y)

Wedding or workshop, what a choice to make. How much did you pay them to delay your green card. :ROFLMAO:
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Now to claim that I had any hand in it? Well let’s just say you don’t mess about with the us border force! I was really on edge ( read really Cacking it) imagining all sorts of things that could go wrong at my interview. In the end it went very well, one question on the inch and a half of paperwork was have you ever been in a military type thing, well you don’t not tell the truth so I said that I had been in the Army Cadet Force when I was 15. What tickled him was that I attained the rank of Lance Bombadier, he hadn’t come across one of those before. He was most interested when I told him about the white string Lanyard which was a throwback to lighting the fuse on Cannons.
Also far from delaying the Green card, mine has gone through the system remarkably quickly, at one point the expected time was 17 months, I have got mine in 7, and you can’t leave in that time!
But I must agree with you wedding or workshop — no contest lol.
 
Back to work.
When I removed some 4 mm ply on the L/H wall it exposed two big voids, so horizontal rails had to be installed to enable me to fasten the new wall via the Furring strips, these strips have to be all the same height off the floor so that when the plasterboard is on I can find them easily. So I have prepared a stick all marked up with centres, this will be kept and used when things have to be hung on the walls later.

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Shows the exposed voids

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This is the marked up stick in action

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Occupational hazard in America where machine gun happy nailers have been in action, they’re razor sharp and nasty.
The rails went in a treat, what I call a hammer fit, tight enough that they hold themselves whilst I get the screws in.

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That’s that finished, you may wonder about the spacing, I decided that I wasn’t going to be worried about fastening to the lower wall and I have two rails at approximately cupboard hanging height, now I can start on the floor.
I am doing it the same way I have in my two previous workshops, I think it’s called a sleeper floor, frames over an existing concrete floor all held up on bits of packing to level it out, never bothered with underfloor insulation before- I probably should have, but here it’s a definite.
 
Sorting out a sliding door that’s no longer needed and came across this joist? Didn’t reach the wall so they nailed a bit of 6x1” on the side to extend it and hung that onto a v short bit of wood nailed to the wall! And because they knew it wasn’t very good they fastened it to the roof above as well!
Must say that generally the barn which has stood for 200 years is built properly, except I’ve just tested a back corner with a sheet of ply for square and the wall is out by 2 1/2” over 4 feet, I shan’t try and shim the wall back into square, just not worth the effort. I suppose back in the day if it looked about right it would be fine, it’s a barn after all.
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Now the question is there was a 10’ sliding door and it was too heavy to move so I’ve cut it up into three bits, one of the bits is old and has been a hinged door at some point in its life, it’s got a beaded edge to the planks and it occurred to me with a bit of work it could be reused as the workshop door, I could add some space age insulation and a sheet of ply to stiffen it up.
I think I’ve been infected with the American love of old tatty wood lol. I had already decided that the end wall (which doesn’t exist yet and is to have the door in it) should be quite rustic/cabin like. What does anyone think?

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This is sort of the look I was going for. But not quite so dilapidated lol.

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duke said:
You can get alot done when not doing the missus list. Looking good.
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Haha, is that the same as a Honey do? Oh don’t worry I’ve got a list all right!
But I’ve also got a missus that likes to be there when I’m a doing, to keep an eye on things, so not so much of a list thank goodness.
I’d never come across a steam radiator system before, it’s what we’ve got here, old cast iron rads, so we got a company to come and take them to be shot blasted and resprayed, my job is to re decorate the walls and floor that hasn’t seen daylight for a Hundred years. It’s such an old system that there’s only one pipe to each rad. I’ll explain if anyone’s interested?
 
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fiveeyes said:
21/2 ' out you say........you do realize, that it was most likely built by, an Englishman.
getting my hat and cloak.........
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Haha, touché. I know the name of the man who had the house and barn built, and it seems to be a French Norman name. , so dates back to 1066. Settled in Hertfordshire and moved to near where I am in the 1600’s. Hands up, yes it probably was an itinerant Brit (let’s not let the Welsh Scots and Irish off the hook here!) who built the whole thing out of square, I’ve since been outside and checked and it’s not just my lean to it’s the whole building that’s out of kilter, impressive stone walls to the bottom 7’ then timber from there upwards, but due to the sloping land the lean to part doesn’t have a stone wall underneath.
I’ve looked into the way barns are fitted into the landscape here and it’s normal that sloping land is utilised to give access at first floor level ( sometimes with a ramp) then the basement floor is built level with the lower part of the land. I don’t think this is a Brit thing more likely German /Swiss, of which there are lots. So let’s blame them!
Of course the above is slightly complicated by the American system of not having a ground floor level, maybe as everywhere has Basements? what we call the ground floor here is called level 1, so our 1st floor is level 2. Yes I know! But it does perhaps make more sense.
 
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Ok , lets get a discussion on how North America was founded. My ancestors landed from the ship after the May Flower.
 
Started on the floor.
The floor is made up from 6 panels of 8’ x 4’ ( including 3 slightly shorter ones) mainly because they are manageable for me and also trying to screw right at the edges of the plywood would be a pain with 2 sheets landing on 1 1/2” this way each sheet has its own frame.
You may have noticed the new name for the workshop, “ The Wonkey Donkey “ well that’s because there isn’t one bit of the barn that the workshop is being built into that’s flat or level or square! The 22’ x 12’ raft of a floor when the panels are screwed together will be levelled up in dozens of places.
This shows the panels being screwed together on top of a sheet of ply, this ensures that they go together square and flat, and yes I’m using screws here in the land of the nail gun, my personal preference and I’m absolutely sure it will be stronger.
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Production line!
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This one was a bit warped and needed a little persuasion before screwing to the next frame, the ply doesn’t have T&G edges.
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And now I’m stuck for a while waiting for the leaky pool equipment to be moved to its new home. Then I can get on with the rest of the floor.
This is as far as I can go
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Yes there will be lots and lots of levelling stacks, I hadn’t considered blocking it as the ply will be screwed down to it all over the place, do you think it needs it? Done it this way twice before without any problems, but always open to suggestions.
 
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