Musclechuck - anti-rust advice requested...

[Eric the Viking]

Thanks to Mr. Maskery's move abroad a few years ago (well, huge thanks to Mr. M himself actually), I'm the happy owner of an Incra router table and positioner. IT took me ages to get around to setting it up, but I did so over Christmas 2023, and I'm extremely glad I did.

I've fitted my Trend T11 via an Incra plate designed for it. Although I modded the T11 years ago to increase the collet height WRT the tabletop, so I could do cutter changes above the table, it's fiddly because of the metal cabinet the tabletop is on (access to the spindle lock button is awkward), so, in the spring of '24 I swallowed hard and bought a Musclechuck 2E, making above-table cutter changes really easy.

The Musclechuck has been easy to set up and use, running dead true from the beginning, with none of the issues I feared. OK, I've yet to try it with a monster panel-raiser, but I now have high hopes it will work well, and it hasn't missed a beat doing decorative mouldings. But...

I have the completely blind insert for the Incra plate, which I clip-in when the router isn't in use. In my old table (using the same supporting frame) simply covering the plate above the router was sufficient to keep it dry in the most damp parts of winter. The Incra arrangement seems to makes a better seal (certainly for sawdust), but I was horrified to find today that rust was starting on the Musclechuck, whiich was right underneath the blank insert.

I took it off and gently cleaned it with the Toolstation equivalent of a mild Scotchbrite pad, and it looks OK, but I know once something has flash rusted in the past, it's more prone to rust thereafter and that worries me.

So what's the best way to try to prevent rust restarting?

Given what it's for, I'm nervous about using oil or Liberon wax on it directly, in case the cutter shanks slip in use. I'm wondering about squirting a little WD40 into a small ziploc bag and putting that over the top (so it won't run down into the central hole). The table is open to the air on both sides underneath. I'm wondering if just wiping WD40 onto the outside will work for the legendary 40 days - obviously I'll only foind out if it doesn't!

I know it's a silly problem but you guys have really clever ideas on this sort of thing, and I'm trying to avoid a "Why didn't you just...?" moment.

For the record, I usually put some effort into cleaning up all traces of sawdust after using the router table, bandsaw, P/T, etc., as I know how it takes up moisture and encourages rust. It's been clean and covered while not used, but I can't seem to protect against really humid days that we've had recently.

E.

PS: other Musclechucks have a nickel coating, but this one is just some sort of mild steel, albeit well finished.

 

[Steve Maskery]

Hi Eric,
Glad you are pleased with your acquisition
I've not had that problem (I use the Xtreme Xtension, but the principle is the same). Have you considered just covering the outside with candle wax? Plug the hole with a bung or tissue paper or something, then drip a candle all over it.
Or cover it with a small ziplock back with some desiccant in it?
S

 

[AndyT]

I've got a can of this stuff, from Workshop Heaven, which is designed for problems like that but doesn't rely on making steel slippery:

Shield Technology VanGuard Anti-Rust Coating 250ml

Shield Technology VanGuard Anti-Rust Coating 250ml. Find Shield Technology's woodworking range at Workshop Heaven. Next day delivery option.

workshopheaven.com

When I used it to protect some carving tools, it looked a bit like a clear matt varnish.

You're welcome to use enough to cover your chuck, if you want.

On other stuff (mostly old cast iron) I have just used boiled linseed oil, thinned down a bit with white spirit and wiped on with a rag. It's worked for me.

 

[Steve Maskery]

On other stuff (mostly old cast iron) I have just used boiled linseed oil, thinned down a bit with white spirit and wiped on with a rag. It's worked for me.

Ooh, that sounds like a good idea, I'll have to try that. I have loads of BLO.
S

 

[Dr.Al]

WD40 isn't a good choice. It's very good at displacing water, but not as a protective coat.

As AndyT said get a proper protector, Shield Vanguard or Metalguard is good, as is Rust Veto or Rustilo.

 

[Eric the Viking]

Sorry I haven't responded earlier. Thanks everyone - I'll investigate the products mentioned.

The reason for the delay is that I now have issues with the Musclechuck itself:

I dismounted it, and carefully cleaned off the rust (outside only), using a grey pad (Toolstation's finest). Then I cleaned it with IPA and carefully checked it for debris in the bore and slots. I put it back on the router, and set it up for a moulding run in the router table.

I've been using a cornice/crown moulding profile cutter, similar to this one (but from Axminster, not Wealden). I've had it for ages but not used it before, and it's tall and heavy (but not very wide).

It was very, very rough running. A bit of re-adjustment toned it down a bit, and I used it, after dropping the speed down a lot. Result wasn't very nice - you can actually see the vibrations in the scooped marks made in the stock. Useable, but obviously a problem.

Dismantle the router table. Start measuring stuff (dial indicator clamped to the table's plate). There's almost no runout on the router shaft itself, as far as I can see, <0.03mm. I don't have a DTI (i.e. the lever type), so I'm using a normal dial indicator ("piston" type), which is seriously awkward. With the Musclechuck in place, this goes up almost tenfold, to around 0.27mm, and it doesn't seem to be affected by position WRT the router shaft, although I'm not yet confident in my measurements (see below).

I have a carefully looked-after, 1/2", ground, silver-steel bar. As far as I can tell, it's pretty straight, and serves as a 'dummy cutter' for alignment and measurement purposes. When the normal collet and nut are used, it shows very little runout (worse than the shaft alone, but not by much. My brand-new, spare collet and nut are worse (the Musclechuck web site says this is normal!). So I'm looking for an actual DTI on eBay presently, and will repeat all measurments properly ASAP. Also getting a cheap laser tacho to calibrate the "1-to-6" settings on the T11.

Suspects so far:

1. Previously unused cutter (unbalanced or bent shaft).
2. Something preventing MC from seating correctly (have looked, have cleaned both shaft and MC: have no dramatic improvement).
3. Musclechuck damaged by my ham-fistedness taking it off and replacing it (unlikely as I don't think I could get close to 12 foot-lbs of torque).
4. Musclechuck damaged by (1) above, or loose/loose-cutter in use (unlikely)
5. Router main or back bearing failing (unlikely but not impossible). Runout is repeatable, but I haven't moved the dial indicator WRT the router casing, so that ought to rule out race wear. Also there's no measurable slop, but I need a better measuring jig to know for certain.

I've probably missed something. I must emphasize I've no insights, presently.

I'm positive I haven't overtightened the Musclechuck, but access to the spindle lock and simultaneously the 1" nut on the MC is really awkward. So I'll wait to see what a better DTI will show. I've also yet to think of a clever way of checking the cutter itself. That might come down to an 'elephant's foot' on the dial indicator, brushing across the two carbide knives, but it's a bit crude and will need the runout of the collet taken into account somehow.

It's been a frustrating week-end...

E.

 

[HdV]

I stopped using the Musclechucks. I had similar problems to what you describe. When, on top of that, the bits started creeping "up" in my router table I decided I had enough. It might certainly be the problem lies with me, like not tightening the chucks enough or something like that, but it wasn't worth the hassle to me anymore. I went back to using old-fashioned collets.